If NASA scientists are right, the Thames will be freezing ov

Phil Hobbs · Feb 7, 2012

mrstarbom@gmail.com wrote:

Red herring.

Thanks for the heads-up. I'll ignore your subsequent posts then.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

(Who spent the morning goofing off, but has to get back to work.)

--
Dr Philip C D Hobbs
Principal Consultant
ElectroOptical Innovations LLC
Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics

160 North State Road #203
Briarcliff Manor NY 10510
845-480-2058

hobbs at electrooptical dot net
http://electrooptical.net

John Larkin · Feb 7, 2012

On Mon, 6 Feb 2012 09:33:12 -0800 (PST), Bill Sloman
<bill.sloman@ieee.org> wrote:

On Feb 6, 4:23 pm, John Larkin
jjlar...@highNOTlandTHIStechnologyPART.com> wrote:
On Mon, 06 Feb 2012 10:54:04 +0100, Glenn <glenn2...@gmail.com> wrote:
On 30/01/12 15.39, amdx wrote:

snip

And GW do not exclude severe winters:

Potsdam Institute for Climate Impact Research (2010, November 17).
Global warming could cool down northern temperatures in winter.
ScienceDaily:
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2010/11/101117114028.htm
Citat: "...
"Recent severe winters like last year's or the one of 2005-06 do not
conflict with the global warming picture, but rather supplement it."
...
Warming of the air over the Barents-Kara Sea seems to bring cold winter
winds to Europe. "This is not what one would expect,"

That last line pretty much sums up the current state of climate
modeling.

If it only produced results that everybody expected, there wouldn't be
a lot of point in doing it.

The Barents-Kara Sea phenomena doesn't make the average global
temperature lower, it just occasionally dumps a lot of cold air and
snow on northern Europe.

So now we have a name for something that has been happening for
millions of years.

--

John Larkin, President
Highland Technology, Inc

jlarkin at highlandtechnology dot com
http://www.highlandtechnology.com

Precision electronic instrumentation
Picosecond-resolution Digital Delay and Pulse generators
Custom laser controllers
Photonics and fiberoptic TTL data links
VME thermocouple, LVDT, synchro acquisition and simulation

John Larkin · Feb 7, 2012

On Mon, 6 Feb 2012 20:28:46 -0800 (PST), Bill Sloman
<bill.sloman@ieee.org> wrote:

On Feb 7, 2:57 am, John Larkin <jlar...@highlandtechnology.com> wrote:
On Mon, 06 Feb 2012 20:23:46 -0500, "k...@att.bizzzzzzzzzzzz"

k...@att.bizzzzzzzzzzzz> wrote:
On Mon, 06 Feb 2012 07:23:10 -0800, John Larkin
jjlar...@highNOTlandTHIStechnologyPART.com> wrote:

On Mon, 06 Feb 2012 10:54:04 +0100, Glenn <glenn2...@gmail.com> wrote:

On 30/01/12 15.39, amdx wrote:
Met Office releases new figures which show no warming in 15 years
Met = UK's National Weather Service

"The supposed consensus on man-made global warming is facing an
inconvenient challenge after the release of new temperature data showing
the planet has not warmed for the past 15 years.

The figures suggest that we could even be heading for a mini ice age to
rival the 70-year temperature drop that saw frost fairs held on the
Thames in the 17th Century.

Based on readings from more than 30,000 measuring stations, the data was
issued last week without fanfare by the Met Office and the University of
East Anglia Climatic Research Unit. It confirms that the rising trend in
world temperatures ended in 1997."

Guess What? There's controversy!

Read more:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2093264/Forget-global-...

Mikek

Hi!

You simply has to read this article:

The heat period (1937-1947) variability and extreme weather "drowns"
compared to the weather the last 10-15 years! (see among others figure
5, 7 in the article):

10 November 2011, Climate Variability and Climate Change: The New
Climate Dice:
http://www.columbia.edu/~jeh1/mailings/2011/20111110_NewClimateDice.pdf

And GW do not exclude severe winters:

Potsdam Institute for Climate Impact Research (2010, November 17).
Global warming could cool down northern temperatures in winter.
ScienceDaily:
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2010/11/101117114028.htm
Citat: "...
"Recent severe winters like last year's or the one of 2005-06 do not
conflict with the global warming picture, but rather supplement it."
...
Warming of the air over the Barents-Kara Sea seems to bring cold winter
winds to Europe. "This is not what one would expect,"

That last line pretty much sums up the current state of climate
modeling.

Isn't that pretty much expected from a chaotic system?

Yes. Everything causes everything, so more CO2 *does* cause a winter
storm. But less CO2 would cause different winter storms. The bottom
line is that climate models do great modeling the past, given that
parameters are tweaked to do so.

Every time something new and unexpected happens, an explanation, like
this one, is manufactured.

Check the publication dates. The Barents- and Kara-Sea ice story was a
real prediction.

If enough people make enough predictions, some will be right. Remember
David Viner's claim that children will not know what snow is in the
future?

--

John Larkin, President
Highland Technology, Inc

jlarkin at highlandtechnology dot com
http://www.highlandtechnology.com

Precision electronic instrumentation
Picosecond-resolution Digital Delay and Pulse generators
Custom laser controllers
Photonics and fiberoptic TTL data links
VME thermocouple, LVDT, synchro acquisition and simulation

Feb 7, 2012

Red herring.

John Larkin · Feb 7, 2012

On Tue, 7 Feb 2012 14:40:00 -0800 (PST), Bill Sloman
<bill.sloman@ieee.org> wrote:

On Feb 7, 4:14 pm, John Larkin
jjlar...@highNOTlandTHIStechnologyPART.com> wrote:
On Tue, 7 Feb 2012 03:49:26 -0800 (PST),BillSloman

bill.slo...@ieee.org> wrote:
On Feb 7, 7:35 am, John Larkin
jjlar...@highNOTlandTHIStechnologyPART.com> wrote:
On Sun, 5 Feb 2012 18:39:26 -0800 (PST),BillSloman

bill.slo...@ieee.org> wrote:
On Feb 5, 10:41 pm, John Larkin
jjlar...@highNOTlandTHIStechnologyPART.com> wrote:
On Sun, 05 Feb 2012 15:19:57 -0500, Phil Hobbs

pcdhSpamMeSensel...@electrooptical.net> wrote:
John Larkin wrote:

On Sun, 05 Feb 2012 18:36:08 +0000, Raveninghorde
raveninghorde@invalid> wrote:

On Sat, 04 Feb 2012 14:35:40 -0800, Joerg <inva...@invalid.invalid
wrote:

amdx wrote:
Met Office releases new figures which show no warming in 15 years
Met = UK's National Weather Service

Some of the rivers are already in the process of freezing over:

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/object/article?f=/n/a/2012/02/03/intern...

[...]

Cold enough here that watefalls have frozen

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-16892848

Ice skating in the fens in Eastern England and -22C reported in the
Netherlands.

Good grief. Cold kills.

Well, as the old saw says, it's an ill wind that blows nobody good.
We've had an Indian summer that lasted all the way through January. The
last couple of nights it's been about freezing, but we've hardly had a
frost all winter. On Groundhog Day, everyone was saying that they
didn't care if ol' Punxsutawney Phil saw his shadow or not, because
another 6 weeks of _this_ winter would be no big hardship.

Folks elsewhere that aren't used to it are having a bad time, though.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

It's been balmy and sunny in San Francisco this week, and overall warm
and dry so far this winter. That's nice for walking and gardening, but
bad for skiing and for the water supply.

If you were to (somehow) plot mean human welfare against mean
planetary temperature, I'd guess we're currently located at an
up-slope, wild guess +5% per degree C.

It's unlikely that human welfare is a linear function of planetary
temperature. For one thing, weather-related human welfare tends to
depend on rainfall as well as temperature, and the occasional tornado
or cyclone can makes a few people decidedly unhappy and uncomfortable
more or less independent of temperature.

It's all going to be a little more complicated than you'd like to
think (if you liked to think about anything outside of electronics,
doesn't seem to happen).

You don't believe in derivatives?

Of course I believe in derivatives, but since I know a bit more than
you do, I get to believe in non-linear responses to a range of
environmental factors, and second order partial derivatives to
describe how "human welfare" - and other ill-defined scoring functions
- vary with - say - rainfall and temperature at the same time.

Word salad. Hand waving.

And the substantive content of "You don't believe in derivatives?" is?

You'd have to come up with some justification to demonstrate that that
wasn't hand-waving, and you really don't have the skills to do it.

You know so much about so many things that you are paralyzed.

Paralysed? Not really. Maybe too easily distracted. Nobody is offering
me money to pursue any particular goal,

I sure wouldn't.

--

John Larkin, President
Highland Technology, Inc

jlarkin at highlandtechnology dot com
http://www.highlandtechnology.com

Precision electronic instrumentation
Picosecond-resolution Digital Delay and Pulse generators
Custom laser controllers
Photonics and fiberoptic TTL data links
VME thermocouple, LVDT, synchro acquisition and simulation

Jamie · Feb 7, 2012

Bill Sloman wrote:

On Feb 7, 7:23 pm, mrstar...@gmail.com wrote:

Red herring.

We already know that you are an ignorant twit. There's no need to keep
reminding us of the fact.

--
Bill Sloman, Nijmegen
You say we? Are you speaking for others or the voices in your head?

Btw, I noticed it took you long enough to dig yourself out of that 6"
of snow that fell over there? Guess that socialist's snow removal isn't
much better than the rest of the services they provide.

Jamie

Jamie · Feb 7, 2012

Bill Sloman wrote:

On Feb 7, 7:38 pm, John Larkin <jlar...@highlandtechnology.com> wrote:

On Mon, 6 Feb 2012 20:28:46 -0800 (PST),BillSloman

bill.slo...@ieee.org> wrote:

On Feb 7, 2:57 am, John Larkin <jlar...@highlandtechnology.com> wrote:

On Mon, 06 Feb 2012 20:23:46 -0500, "k...@att.bizzzzzzzzzzzz"

k...@att.bizzzzzzzzzzzz> wrote:

On Mon, 06 Feb 2012 07:23:10 -0800, John Larkin
jjlar...@highNOTlandTHIStechnologyPART.com> wrote:

On Mon, 06 Feb 2012 10:54:04 +0100, Glenn <glenn2...@gmail.com> wrote:

On 30/01/12 15.39, amdx wrote:

Met Office releases new figures which show no warming in 15 years
Met = UK's National Weather Service

"The supposed consensus on man-made global warming is facing an
inconvenient challenge after the release of new temperature data showing
the planet has not warmed for the past 15 years.

The figures suggest that we could even be heading for a mini ice age to
rival the 70-year temperature drop that saw frost fairs held on the
Thames in the 17th Century.

Based on readings from more than 30,000 measuring stations, the data was
issued last week without fanfare by the Met Office and the University of
East Anglia Climatic Research Unit. It confirms that the rising trend in
world temperatures ended in 1997."

Guess What? There's controversy!

Read more:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2093264/Forget-global-...

Mikek

Hi!

You simply has to read this article:

The heat period (1937-1947) variability and extreme weather "drowns"
compared to the weather the last 10-15 years! (see among others figure
5, 7 in the article):

10 November 2011, Climate Variability and Climate Change: The New
Climate Dice:
http://www.columbia.edu/~jeh1/mailings/2011/20111110_NewClimateDice.pdf

And GW do not exclude severe winters:

Potsdam Institute for Climate Impact Research (2010, November 17).
Global warming could cool down northern temperatures in winter.
ScienceDaily:
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2010/11/101117114028.htm
Citat: "...
"Recent severe winters like last year's or the one of 2005-06 do not
conflict with the global warming picture, but rather supplement it."
...
Warming of the air over the Barents-Kara Sea seems to bring cold winter
winds to Europe. "This is not what one would expect,"

That last line pretty much sums up the current state of climate
modeling.

Isn't that pretty much expected from a chaotic system?

Yes. Everything causes everything, so more CO2 *does* cause a winter
storm. But less CO2 would cause different winter storms. The bottom
line is that climate models do great modeling the past, given that
parameters are tweaked to do so.

Every time something new and unexpected happens, an explanation, like
this one, is manufactured.

Check the publication dates. The Barents- and Kara-Sea ice story was a
real prediction.

If enough people make enough predictions, some will be right. Remember
David Viner's claim that children will not know what snow is in the
future?

As predictions go, a half-baked conversation with a British science
journalist falls a long way short of authoritative prophecy.

Talking about half baked, coming from one that is half cocked most of
the time..

"Here comes Billy with his pecker in his hand"
"He's a one ball man"
"And he's off to the rodeo"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=utRtwIY0YaM&skipcontrinter=1

Jamie

Jim Thompson · Feb 7, 2012

On Tue, 7 Feb 2012 14:40:00 -0800 (PST), Bill Sloman
<bill.sloman@ieee.org> wrote:

[snip]

Nobody is offering
me money to pursue any particular goal, and thirty years in industry
did teach me to keep any eye on financial advantage.

Bill Sloman · Feb 7, 2012

On Feb 7, 4:14 pm, John Larkin
<jjlar...@highNOTlandTHIStechnologyPART.com> wrote:

On Tue, 7 Feb 2012 03:49:26 -0800 (PST),BillSloman

bill.slo...@ieee.org> wrote:
On Feb 7, 7:35 am, John Larkin
jjlar...@highNOTlandTHIStechnologyPART.com> wrote:
On Sun, 5 Feb 2012 18:39:26 -0800 (PST),BillSloman

bill.slo...@ieee.org> wrote:
On Feb 5, 10:41 pm, John Larkin
jjlar...@highNOTlandTHIStechnologyPART.com> wrote:
On Sun, 05 Feb 2012 15:19:57 -0500, Phil Hobbs

pcdhSpamMeSensel...@electrooptical.net> wrote:
John Larkin wrote:

On Sun, 05 Feb 2012 18:36:08 +0000, Raveninghorde
raveninghorde@invalid> wrote:

On Sat, 04 Feb 2012 14:35:40 -0800, Joerg <inva...@invalid.invalid
wrote:

amdx wrote:
Met Office releases new figures which show no warming in 15 years
Met = UK's National Weather Service

Some of the rivers are already in the process of freezing over:

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/object/article?f=/n/a/2012/02/03/intern...

[...]

Cold enough here that watefalls have frozen

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-16892848

Ice skating in the fens in Eastern England and -22C reported in the
Netherlands.

Good grief. Cold kills.

Well, as the old saw says, it's an ill wind that blows nobody good..
We've had an Indian summer that lasted all the way through January.. The
last couple of nights it's been about freezing, but we've hardly had a
frost all winter. On Groundhog Day, everyone was saying that they
didn't care if ol' Punxsutawney Phil saw his shadow or not, because
another 6 weeks of _this_ winter would be no big hardship.

Folks elsewhere that aren't used to it are having a bad time, though.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

It's been balmy and sunny in San Francisco this week, and overall warm
and dry so far this winter. That's nice for walking and gardening, but
bad for skiing and for the water supply.

If you were to (somehow) plot mean human welfare against mean
planetary temperature, I'd guess we're currently located at an
up-slope, wild guess +5% per degree C.

It's unlikely that human welfare is a linear function of planetary
temperature. For one thing, weather-related human welfare tends to
depend on rainfall as well as temperature, and the occasional tornado
or cyclone can makes a few people decidedly unhappy and uncomfortable
more or less independent of temperature.

It's all going to be a little more complicated than you'd like to
think (if you liked to think about anything outside of electronics,
doesn't seem to happen).

You don't believe in derivatives?

Of course I believe in derivatives, but since I know a bit more than
you do, I get to believe in non-linear responses to a range of
environmental factors, and second order partial derivatives to
describe how "human welfare" - and other ill-defined scoring functions
- vary with - say - rainfall and temperature at the same time.

Word salad. Hand waving.

And the substantive content of "You don't believe in derivatives?" is?

You'd have to come up with some justification to demonstrate that that
wasn't hand-waving, and you really don't have the skills to do it.

You know so much about so many things that you are paralyzed.

Paralysed? Not really. Maybe too easily distracted. Nobody is offering
me money to pursue any particular goal, and thirty years in industry
did teach me to keep any eye on financial advantage.

--
Bill Sloman, Nijmegen

Bill Sloman · Feb 7, 2012

On Feb 7, 7:34 pm, John Larkin <jlar...@highlandtechnology.com> wrote:

On Mon, 6 Feb 2012 09:33:12 -0800 (PST),BillSloman

bill.slo...@ieee.org> wrote:
On Feb 6, 4:23 pm, John Larkin
jjlar...@highNOTlandTHIStechnologyPART.com> wrote:
On Mon, 06 Feb 2012 10:54:04 +0100, Glenn <glenn2...@gmail.com> wrote:
On 30/01/12 15.39, amdx wrote:

snip

And GW do not exclude severe winters:

Potsdam Institute for Climate Impact Research (2010, November 17).
Global warming could cool down northern temperatures in winter.
ScienceDaily:
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2010/11/101117114028.htm
Citat: "...
"Recent severe winters like last year's or the one of 2005-06 do not
conflict with the global warming picture, but rather supplement it."
...
Warming of the air over the Barents-Kara Sea seems to bring cold winter
winds to Europe. "This is not what one would expect,"

That last line pretty much sums up the current state of climate
modeling.

If it only produced results that everybody expected, there wouldn't be
a lot of point in doing it.

The Barents-Kara Sea phenomena doesn't make the average global
temperature lower, it just occasionally dumps a lot of cold air and
snow on northern Europe.

So now we have a name for something that has been happening for
millions of years.

There will have been exceptionally cold spells in the midst of
European winters for the past few million years. The particular sort
of particularly cold spell you get when the Barents and Kara Seas are
ice-free is going to become more frequent as anthropogenic global
warming thins out the ice cover on the Artic Ocean, and the people
stocking up salt to keep European roads ice-free in winter are going
to have to keep that in mind, as are the people who are responsible
for keeping the points on the railway lines from getting jammed with
lumps of ice. The Dutch railways now heat their points in winter, but
clearly not enough to deal with severe winter weather.

--
Bill Sloman, Nijmegen

Bill Sloman · Feb 7, 2012

On Feb 7, 7:38 pm, John Larkin <jlar...@highlandtechnology.com> wrote:

On Mon, 6 Feb 2012 20:28:46 -0800 (PST),BillSloman

bill.slo...@ieee.org> wrote:
On Feb 7, 2:57 am, John Larkin <jlar...@highlandtechnology.com> wrote:
On Mon, 06 Feb 2012 20:23:46 -0500, "k...@att.bizzzzzzzzzzzz"

k...@att.bizzzzzzzzzzzz> wrote:
On Mon, 06 Feb 2012 07:23:10 -0800, John Larkin
jjlar...@highNOTlandTHIStechnologyPART.com> wrote:

On Mon, 06 Feb 2012 10:54:04 +0100, Glenn <glenn2...@gmail.com> wrote:

On 30/01/12 15.39, amdx wrote:
Met Office releases new figures which show no warming in 15 years
Met = UK's National Weather Service

"The supposed consensus on man-made global warming is facing an
inconvenient challenge after the release of new temperature data showing
the planet has not warmed for the past 15 years.

The figures suggest that we could even be heading for a mini ice age to
rival the 70-year temperature drop that saw frost fairs held on the
Thames in the 17th Century.

Based on readings from more than 30,000 measuring stations, the data was
issued last week without fanfare by the Met Office and the University of
East Anglia Climatic Research Unit. It confirms that the rising trend in
world temperatures ended in 1997."

Guess What? There's controversy!

Read more:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2093264/Forget-global-...

Mikek

Hi!

You simply has to read this article:

The heat period (1937-1947) variability and extreme weather "drowns"
compared to the weather the last 10-15 years! (see among others figure
5, 7 in the article):

10 November 2011, Climate Variability and Climate Change: The New
Climate Dice:
http://www.columbia.edu/~jeh1/mailings/2011/20111110_NewClimateDice..pdf

And GW do not exclude severe winters:

Potsdam Institute for Climate Impact Research (2010, November 17).
Global warming could cool down northern temperatures in winter.
ScienceDaily:
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2010/11/101117114028.htm
Citat: "...
"Recent severe winters like last year's or the one of 2005-06 do not
conflict with the global warming picture, but rather supplement it."
...
Warming of the air over the Barents-Kara Sea seems to bring cold winter
winds to Europe. "This is not what one would expect,"

That last line pretty much sums up the current state of climate
modeling.

Isn't that pretty much expected from a chaotic system?

Yes. Everything causes everything, so more CO2 *does* cause a winter
storm. But less CO2 would cause different winter storms. The bottom
line is that climate models do great modeling the past, given that
parameters are tweaked to do so.

Every time something new and unexpected happens, an explanation, like
this one, is manufactured.

Check the publication dates. The Barents- and Kara-Sea ice story was a
real prediction.

If enough people make enough predictions, some will be right. Remember
David Viner's claim that children will not know what snow is in the
future?

As predictions go, a half-baked conversation with a British science
journalist falls a long way short of authoritative prophecy.

The Barents-and-Kara-Seeas story was at least published as a
scientific paper in a peer-reviewed journal. You may not appreciate
the difference, but it's nevertheless significant.

--
Bill Sloman, Nijmegen

John Larkin · Feb 7, 2012

On Tue, 7 Feb 2012 15:13:37 -0800 (PST), Bill Sloman
<bill.sloman@ieee.org> wrote:

On Feb 8, 12:01 am, John Larkin <jlar...@highlandtechnology.com
wrote:
On Tue, 7 Feb 2012 14:40:00 -0800 (PST), Bill Sloman

bill.slo...@ieee.org> wrote:
On Feb 7, 4:14 pm, John Larkin
jjlar...@highNOTlandTHIStechnologyPART.com> wrote:
On Tue, 7 Feb 2012 03:49:26 -0800 (PST),BillSloman

bill.slo...@ieee.org> wrote:
On Feb 7, 7:35 am, John Larkin
jjlar...@highNOTlandTHIStechnologyPART.com> wrote:
On Sun, 5 Feb 2012 18:39:26 -0800 (PST),BillSloman

bill.slo...@ieee.org> wrote:
On Feb 5, 10:41 pm, John Larkin
jjlar...@highNOTlandTHIStechnologyPART.com> wrote:
On Sun, 05 Feb 2012 15:19:57 -0500, Phil Hobbs

pcdhSpamMeSensel...@electrooptical.net> wrote:
John Larkin wrote:

On Sun, 05 Feb 2012 18:36:08 +0000, Raveninghorde
raveninghorde@invalid> wrote:

On Sat, 04 Feb 2012 14:35:40 -0800, Joerg <inva...@invalid.invalid
wrote:

amdx wrote:
Met Office releases new figures which show no warming in 15 years
Met = UK's National Weather Service

Some of the rivers are already in the process of freezing over:

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/object/article?f=/n/a/2012/02/03/intern...

[...]

Cold enough here that watefalls have frozen

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-16892848

Ice skating in the fens in Eastern England and -22C reported in the
Netherlands.

Good grief. Cold kills.

Well, as the old saw says, it's an ill wind that blows nobody good.
We've had an Indian summer that lasted all the way through January. The
last couple of nights it's been about freezing, but we've hardly had a
frost all winter. On Groundhog Day, everyone was saying that they
didn't care if ol' Punxsutawney Phil saw his shadow or not, because
another 6 weeks of _this_ winter would be no big hardship.

Folks elsewhere that aren't used to it are having a bad time, though.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

It's been balmy and sunny in San Francisco this week, and overall warm
and dry so far this winter. That's nice for walking and gardening, but
bad for skiing and for the water supply.

If you were to (somehow) plot mean human welfare against mean
planetary temperature, I'd guess we're currently located at an
up-slope, wild guess +5% per degree C.

It's unlikely that human welfare is a linear function of planetary
temperature. For one thing, weather-related human welfare tends to
depend on rainfall as well as temperature, and the occasional tornado
or cyclone can makes a few people decidedly unhappy and uncomfortable
more or less independent of temperature.

It's all going to be a little more complicated than you'd like to
think (if you liked to think about anything outside of electronics,
doesn't seem to happen).

You don't believe in derivatives?

Of course I believe in derivatives, but since I know a bit more than
you do, I get to believe in non-linear responses to a range of
environmental factors, and second order partial derivatives to
describe how "human welfare" - and other ill-defined scoring functions
- vary with - say - rainfall and temperature at the same time.

Word salad. Hand waving.

And the substantive content of "You don't believe in derivatives?" is?

You'd have to come up with some justification to demonstrate that that
wasn't hand-waving, and you really don't have the skills to do it.

You know so much about so many things that you are paralyzed.

Paralysed? Not really. Maybe too easily distracted. Nobody is offering
me money to pursue any particular goal,

I sure wouldn't.

Another vanity-driven failure of judgement.

Hey, you're repulsive. It's against company policy to hire repulsive
people.

--

John Larkin, President
Highland Technology, Inc

jlarkin at highlandtechnology dot com
http://www.highlandtechnology.com

Precision electronic instrumentation
Picosecond-resolution Digital Delay and Pulse generators
Custom laser controllers
Photonics and fiberoptic TTL data links
VME thermocouple, LVDT, synchro acquisition and simulation

Bill Sloman · Feb 7, 2012

On Feb 7, 7:23 pm, mrstar...@gmail.com wrote:

Red herring.

We already know that you are an ignorant twit. There's no need to keep
reminding us of the fact.

--
Bill Sloman, Nijmegen

Bill Sloman · Feb 8, 2012

On Feb 8, 12:01 am, John Larkin <jlar...@highlandtechnology.com>
wrote:

On Tue, 7 Feb 2012 14:40:00 -0800 (PST), Bill Sloman

bill.slo...@ieee.org> wrote:
On Feb 7, 4:14 pm, John Larkin
jjlar...@highNOTlandTHIStechnologyPART.com> wrote:
On Tue, 7 Feb 2012 03:49:26 -0800 (PST),BillSloman

bill.slo...@ieee.org> wrote:
On Feb 7, 7:35 am, John Larkin
jjlar...@highNOTlandTHIStechnologyPART.com> wrote:
On Sun, 5 Feb 2012 18:39:26 -0800 (PST),BillSloman

bill.slo...@ieee.org> wrote:
On Feb 5, 10:41 pm, John Larkin
jjlar...@highNOTlandTHIStechnologyPART.com> wrote:
On Sun, 05 Feb 2012 15:19:57 -0500, Phil Hobbs

pcdhSpamMeSensel...@electrooptical.net> wrote:
John Larkin wrote:

On Sun, 05 Feb 2012 18:36:08 +0000, Raveninghorde
raveninghorde@invalid> wrote:

On Sat, 04 Feb 2012 14:35:40 -0800, Joerg <inva...@invalid.invalid
wrote:

amdx wrote:
Met Office releases new figures which show no warming in 15 years
Met = UK's National Weather Service

Some of the rivers are already in the process of freezing over:

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/object/article?f=/n/a/2012/02/03/intern...

[...]

Cold enough here that watefalls have frozen

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-16892848

Ice skating in the fens in Eastern England and -22C reported in the
Netherlands.

Good grief. Cold kills.

Well, as the old saw says, it's an ill wind that blows nobody good.
We've had an Indian summer that lasted all the way through January. The
last couple of nights it's been about freezing, but we've hardly had a
frost all winter. On Groundhog Day, everyone was saying that they
didn't care if ol' Punxsutawney Phil saw his shadow or not, because
another 6 weeks of _this_ winter would be no big hardship.

Folks elsewhere that aren't used to it are having a bad time, though.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

It's been balmy and sunny in San Francisco this week, and overall warm
and dry so far this winter. That's nice for walking and gardening, but
bad for skiing and for the water supply.

If you were to (somehow) plot mean human welfare against mean
planetary temperature, I'd guess we're currently located at an
up-slope, wild guess +5% per degree C.

It's unlikely that human welfare is a linear function of planetary
temperature. For one thing, weather-related human welfare tends to
depend on rainfall as well as temperature, and the occasional tornado
or cyclone can makes a few people decidedly unhappy and uncomfortable
more or less independent of temperature.

It's all going to be a little more complicated than you'd like to
think (if you liked to think about anything outside of electronics,
doesn't seem to happen).

You don't believe in derivatives?

Of course I believe in derivatives, but since I know a bit more than
you do, I get to believe in non-linear responses to a range of
environmental factors, and second order partial derivatives to
describe how "human welfare" - and other ill-defined scoring functions
- vary with - say - rainfall and temperature at the same time.

Word salad. Hand waving.

And the substantive content of "You don't believe in derivatives?" is?

You'd have to come up with some justification to demonstrate that that
wasn't hand-waving, and you really don't have the skills to do it.

You know so much about so many things that you are paralyzed.

Paralysed? Not really. Maybe too easily distracted. Nobody is offering
me money to pursue any particular goal,

I sure wouldn't.

Another vanity-driven failure of judgement.

--
Bill Sloman, Nijmegen

Bill Sloman · Feb 8, 2012

On Feb 8, 12:16 am, Jamie
<jamie_ka1lpa_not_valid_after_ka1l...@charter.net> wrote:

Bill Sloman wrote:
On Feb 7, 7:38 pm, John Larkin <jlar...@highlandtechnology.com> wrote:

On Mon, 6 Feb 2012 20:28:46 -0800 (PST),BillSloman

bill.slo...@ieee.org> wrote:

On Feb 7, 2:57 am, John Larkin <jlar...@highlandtechnology.com> wrote:

On Mon, 06 Feb 2012 20:23:46 -0500, "k...@att.bizzzzzzzzzzzz"

k...@att.bizzzzzzzzzzzz> wrote:

On Mon, 06 Feb 2012 07:23:10 -0800, John Larkin
jjlar...@highNOTlandTHIStechnologyPART.com> wrote:

On Mon, 06 Feb 2012 10:54:04 +0100, Glenn <glenn2...@gmail.com> wrote:

On 30/01/12 15.39, amdx wrote:

Met Office releases new figures which show no warming in 15 years
Met = UK's National Weather Service

"The supposed consensus on man-made global warming is facing an
inconvenient challenge after the release of new temperature data showing
the planet has not warmed for the past 15 years.

The figures suggest that we could even be heading for a mini ice age to
rival the 70-year temperature drop that saw frost fairs held on the
Thames in the 17th Century.

Based on readings from more than 30,000 measuring stations, the data was
issued last week without fanfare by the Met Office and the University of
East Anglia Climatic Research Unit. It confirms that the rising trend in
world temperatures ended in 1997."

Guess What? There's controversy!

Read more:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2093264/Forget-global-...

Mikek

Hi!

You simply has to read this article:

The heat period (1937-1947) variability and extreme weather "drowns"
compared to the weather the last 10-15 years! (see among others figure
5, 7 in the article):

10 November 2011, Climate Variability and Climate Change: The New
Climate Dice:
http://www.columbia.edu/~jeh1/mailings/2011/20111110_NewClimateDice.pdf

And GW do not exclude severe winters:

Potsdam Institute for Climate Impact Research (2010, November 17).
Global warming could cool down northern temperatures in winter.
ScienceDaily:
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2010/11/101117114028.htm
Citat: "...
"Recent severe winters like last year's or the one of 2005-06 do not
conflict with the global warming picture, but rather supplement it.."
...
Warming of the air over the Barents-Kara Sea seems to bring cold winter
winds to Europe. "This is not what one would expect,"

That last line pretty much sums up the current state of climate
modeling.

Isn't that pretty much expected from a chaotic system?

Yes. Everything causes everything, so more CO2 *does* cause a winter
storm. But less CO2 would cause different winter storms. The bottom
line is that climate models do great modeling the past, given that
parameters are tweaked to do so.

Every time something new and unexpected happens, an explanation, like
this one, is manufactured.

Check the publication dates. The Barents- and Kara-Sea ice story was a
real prediction.

If enough people make enough predictions, some will be right. Remember
David Viner's claim that children will not know what snow is in the
future?

As predictions go, a half-baked conversation with a British science
journalist falls a long way short of authoritative prophecy.

Talking about half baked, coming from one that is half cocked most of
the time..

As if Jamie would know. He's so remarkably ignorant that he hasn't yet
realised how little he knows, and how much of that little is actually
wrong.

<snip>

--
Bill Sloman, Nijmegen

Bill Sloman · Feb 8, 2012

On Feb 8, 12:09 am, Jamie
<jamie_ka1lpa_not_valid_after_ka1l...@charter.net> wrote:

Bill Sloman wrote:
On Feb 7, 7:23 pm, mrstar...@gmail.com wrote:

Red herring.

We already know that you are an ignorant twit. There's no need to keep
reminding us of the fact.

You say we? Are you speaking for others or the voices in your head?

I'm obviously not speaking for you. As another ignorant twit you are
probably unaware of mrstar's inadequacies.

Btw, I noticed it took you long enough to dig yourself out of that 6"
of snow that fell over there? Guess that socialist's snow removal isn't
much better than the rest of the services they provide.

Who do you think you are referring to? The Netherlands got between 5
and 15cm of snow (2" and 6" for the non-scientifically trained),
varying from region to region on Friday 3rd February - a week ago.

It screwed up the railway system, mainly by dumping chunks of ice into
the (heated) points, and it got cold enough overnight that there
wasn't any point in spreading salt on the motorways, because it was
cold enough to freeze brine.

My indoor hockey tournament on the Saturday evening went off without a
hitch - with teams driving over from Apeldoorn, Wageningen and Venlo.
My team ended up second ...

The gritting of the roads is managed by the local town council, and
that worked. The railway system was a mess - there was a failed
privatisation some years ago, and the subsequent fiddling around with
quasi-independent entities running various bits of the railway system
hasn't yet gelled into something that looks likely to last.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nederlandse_Spoorwegen

If there was problem, it's a bit of stretch to blame it on socialism.
Thatcher created a similar mess with the UK railway system at around
about the same time, and the injection of a capitalist cost-saving
ethic famously led to under-maintenance and couple of fatal railway
crashes. The Dutch were never quite that silly.

--
Bill Sloman, Nijmegen

Feb 8, 2012

How will I know? : )

Feb 8, 2012

That kind of lame insult doesn't help your case at all but suggests your position is fairly weak. You might as well accuse me of having a big nose. I've made no claims to the contrary.

Bill Sloman · Feb 8, 2012

On Feb 8, 12:17 am, Jim Thompson <To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-I...@On-My-
Web-Site.com> wrote:

On Tue, 7 Feb 2012 14:40:00 -0800 (PST),BillSloman

bill.slo...@ieee.org> wrote:

[snip]

Nobody is offering
me money to pursue any particular goal, and thirty years in industry
did teach me to keep any eye on financial advantage.

What kind of statement is that? A PhD way of saying I'm so
incompetent that no one will employ me?

Jim really is getting senile. It was a way of saying that I get things
done faster if they makes me money or prevents me from losing money.
I'm too old for any employer in the Netherlands to even think of
giving me work - ageism seems to have been built into the Dutch
character - so my competence doesn't come into the picture.

--
Bill Sloman, Nijmegen

Bill Sloman · Feb 8, 2012

On Feb 8, 12:58 am, John Larkin <jlar...@highlandtechnology.com>
wrote:

On Tue, 7 Feb 2012 15:13:37 -0800 (PST),BillSloman

bill.slo...@ieee.org> wrote:
On Feb 8, 12:01 am, John Larkin <jlar...@highlandtechnology.com
wrote:
On Tue, 7 Feb 2012 14:40:00 -0800 (PST),BillSloman

bill.slo...@ieee.org> wrote:
On Feb 7, 4:14 pm, John Larkin
jjlar...@highNOTlandTHIStechnologyPART.com> wrote:
On Tue, 7 Feb 2012 03:49:26 -0800 (PST),BillSloman

bill.slo...@ieee.org> wrote:
On Feb 7, 7:35 am, John Larkin
jjlar...@highNOTlandTHIStechnologyPART.com> wrote:
On Sun, 5 Feb 2012 18:39:26 -0800 (PST),BillSloman

bill.slo...@ieee.org> wrote:
On Feb 5, 10:41 pm, John Larkin
jjlar...@highNOTlandTHIStechnologyPART.com> wrote:
On Sun, 05 Feb 2012 15:19:57 -0500, Phil Hobbs

pcdhSpamMeSensel...@electrooptical.net> wrote:
John Larkin wrote:

On Sun, 05 Feb 2012 18:36:08 +0000, Raveninghorde
raveninghorde@invalid> wrote:

On Sat, 04 Feb 2012 14:35:40 -0800, Joerg <inva...@invalid.invalid
wrote:

amdx wrote:
Met Office releases new figures which show no warming in 15 years
Met = UK's National Weather Service

Some of the rivers are already in the process of freezing over:

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/object/article?f=/n/a/2012/02/03/intern...

[...]

Cold enough here that watefalls have frozen

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-16892848

Ice skating in the fens in Eastern England and -22C reported in the
Netherlands.

Good grief. Cold kills.

Well, as the old saw says, it's an ill wind that blows nobody good.
We've had an Indian summer that lasted all the way through January. The
last couple of nights it's been about freezing, but we've hardly had a
frost all winter. On Groundhog Day, everyone was saying that they
didn't care if ol' Punxsutawney Phil saw his shadow or not, because
another 6 weeks of _this_ winter would be no big hardship.

Folks elsewhere that aren't used to it are having a bad time, though.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

It's been balmy and sunny in San Francisco this week, and overall warm
and dry so far this winter. That's nice for walking and gardening, but
bad for skiing and for the water supply.

If you were to (somehow) plot mean human welfare against mean
planetary temperature, I'd guess we're currently located at an
up-slope, wild guess +5% per degree C.

It's unlikely that human welfare is a linear function of planetary
temperature. For one thing, weather-related human welfare tends to
depend on rainfall as well as temperature, and the occasional tornado
or cyclone can makes a few people decidedly unhappy and uncomfortable
more or less independent of temperature.

It's all going to be a little more complicated than you'd like to
think (if you liked to think about anything outside of electronics,
doesn't seem to happen).

You don't believe in derivatives?

Of course I believe in derivatives, but since I know a bit more than
you do, I get to believe in non-linear responses to a range of
environmental factors, and second order partial derivatives to
describe how "human welfare" - and other ill-defined scoring functions
- vary with - say - rainfall and temperature at the same time.

Word salad. Hand waving.

And the substantive content of "You don't believe in derivatives?" is?

You'd have to come up with some justification to demonstrate that that
wasn't hand-waving, and you really don't have the skills to do it.

You know so much about so many things that you are paralyzed.

Paralysed? Not really. Maybe too easily distracted. Nobody is offering
me money to pursue any particular goal,

I sure wouldn't.

Another vanity-driven failure of judgement.

Hey, you're repulsive. It's against company policy to hire more repulsive
people.

One was enough? The "high" in Highland refers to the personal odour of
the founder, rather than some elevation in the landscape?

--
Bill Sloman, Nijmegen

If NASA scientists are right, the Thames will be freezing ov

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