transformer buzzzz

[ml]

hi

i have a new properly operating ie not deffective astron (analog) power
supply

naturally even w/no load the transformer makes a bit of a buzz the
usual kind


how do you quite that?

i've seen some transformers in the past completely covered w/metal not
sure if buying such a replacement is practical or if that would 'do ' it

further i presume the transf would get hotter and need additional
cooling ? (astron has no fan)


any tips ?


tnx

 

[Meat Plow]

On Fri, 05 Jan 2007 02:22:05 +0000, ml Has Frothed:

hi

i have a new properly operating ie not deffective astron (analog) power
supply

naturally even w/no load the transformer makes a bit of a buzz the
usual kind


how do you quite that?

i've seen some transformers in the past completely covered w/metal not
sure if buying such a replacement is practical or if that would 'do ' it

further i presume the transf would get hotter and need additional
cooling ? (astron has no fan)


any tips ?

Both my Astron 25 and 35 buzz. I got used to it.

--
Pierre Salinger Memorial Hook, Line & Sinker, June 2004

COOSN-266-06-25794

 

[Eeyore]

ml wrote:

hi

i have a new properly operating ie not deffective astron (analog) power
supply

naturally even w/no load the transformer makes a bit of a buzz the
usual kind

how do you quite that?

With considerable difficulty.

i've seen some transformers in the past completely covered w/metal not
sure if buying such a replacement is practical or if that would 'do ' it

That does other stuff not mechanical noise.

further i presume the transf would get hotter and need additional
cooling ? (astron has no fan)

any tips ?

My suspicion if it's cheap consumer gear is that the transformer has a high
working flux that's close to saturation. There's precious little you can do
about that other than reduce the input volts.

The other possibility is vibrating laminations because they're a bit loose and
there's not a useful lot you can do about that either usually.


Graham

 

[Homer J Simpson]

"ml" <m@di.net> wrote in message
news:m-AE9323.21220004012007@news.verizon.net...

naturally even w/no load the transformer makes a bit of a buzz the
usual kind

any tips ?

Probably a loose lamination.











--

 

[default]

On Fri, 05 Jan 2007 02:22:05 GMT, ml <m@di.net> wrote:

hi

i have a new properly operating ie not deffective astron (analog) power
supply

naturally even w/no load the transformer makes a bit of a buzz the
usual kind


how do you quite that?

i've seen some transformers in the past completely covered w/metal not
sure if buying such a replacement is practical or if that would 'do ' it

further i presume the transf would get hotter and need additional
cooling ? (astron has no fan)


any tips ?

First thing would be to determine the cause. Try a clamp on the

laminations if you can get to them - a C-clamp. If tightening the
laminations together makes it quiet or quieter, the laminations are
noisy.

To correct the problem takes some effort. Take it out of the PS, bake
it in an oven to thoroughly saturate it with heat and dry it - a few
hours at close to 100 C if there's no wax or plastic that will melt -
hot if you can, warm if you must. The construction determines how hot
you can safely get it - but transformers are usually expected to run
hot without failing so they will take some heat.

Once it is hot, suspend it in a can of polyurethane varnish for a half
hour or so - the hot transformer will thin the varnish and the cooling
air spaces will suck varnish between the laminations and eliminate the
buzz. Let it air cure for a few days before putting it back in
service.

Loose coil? A wooden shim driven between the coil and core will fix
that.



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default wrote:

On Fri, 05 Jan 2007 02:22:05 GMT, ml <m@di.net> wrote:

hi

i have a new properly operating ie not deffective astron (analog) power
supply

naturally even w/no load the transformer makes a bit of a buzz the
usual kind


how do you quite that?

i've seen some transformers in the past completely covered w/metal not
sure if buying such a replacement is practical or if that would 'do ' it

further i presume the transf would get hotter and need additional
cooling ? (astron has no fan)


any tips ?

First thing would be to determine the cause. Try a clamp on the
laminations if you can get to them - a C-clamp. If tightening the
laminations together makes it quiet or quieter, the laminations are
noisy.

To correct the problem takes some effort. Take it out of the PS, bake
it in an oven to thoroughly saturate it with heat and dry it - a few
hours at close to 100 C if there's no wax or plastic that will melt -
hot if you can, warm if you must. The construction determines how hot
you can safely get it - but transformers are usually expected to run
hot without failing so they will take some heat.

Once it is hot, suspend it in a can of polyurethane varnish for a half
hour or so - the hot transformer will thin the varnish and the cooling
air spaces will suck varnish between the laminations and eliminate the
buzz. Let it air cure for a few days before putting it back in
service.

Loose coil? A wooden shim driven between the coil and core will fix
that.

A quicker less thorough method that may work is to put a cold chisel
onto the lam edges and give it a tap.

You can also remount the transformer onto rubber blocks to stop it
using the case as a sounding board.

Can also line the interior of the case with cardboard or rubber matting
to damp sound


NT

 

[Snap Whipcrack...........]

ml wrote:

hi

i have a new properly operating ie not deffective astron (analog) power
supply

naturally even w/no load the transformer makes a bit of a buzz the
usual kind


how do you quite that?

i've seen some transformers in the past completely covered w/metal not
sure if buying such a replacement is practical or if that would 'do ' it

further i presume the transf would get hotter and need additional
cooling ? (astron has no fan)


any tips ?


tnx

Soak it in shellac and let it dry. Might tighten up some things. Could
be a lamination acting like a buzzer or the coil rattling on the iron core.

 

[DaveM]

"ml" <m@di.net> wrote in message
news:m-72B8A9.16200705012007@news.verizon.net...

In article <pan.2007.01.05.02.34.09.138000@nntp.sun-meatplow.local>,
Meat Plow <meat@meatplow.local> wrote:

On Fri, 05 Jan 2007 02:22:05 +0000, ml Has Frothed:

hi

i have a new properly operating ie not deffective astron (analog) power
supply

naturally even w/no load the transformer makes a bit of a buzz the
usual kind


how do you quite that?

i've seen some transformers in the past completely covered w/metal not
sure if buying such a replacement is practical or if that would 'do ' it

further i presume the transf would get hotter and need additional
cooling ? (astron has no fan)


any tips ?



Both my Astron 25 and 35 buzz. I got used to it.

silly question, a few here suggested coating /soakn' w/varnich or etc

once it's dried does that stuff withstand the temperatures transformers
get up to? this is a 24hr on device


i am also not opposed to simply replacing the transformer i am sure
it's not cheep but don't know transformer speak buzz wise i know the
input/output spec's but what is a 'quite one ' called just a higher
quality one? a super laminated one or one with metal casing around
the unit? are they transformer firms know to be 'quite'?


i can't add 'insulation' around the case as somone suggested thou i like
the idea since it would trap the heat this unit has no fan

i am aware that all the astrons i've seen do buzz this way i just
want to make it quite seems a simple experiment and mod

i tried putting the entire unit onto rubber isolators it didn't
decrease the sound actually seemd to make it louader a drop there
arent' any coils on the ckt board so opening it up i can tell it's just
a transformer issue

it's a 25amp cont supply @13.8vdc (120ac)

if soaking it in varnish or equiv would work that would be ok by me
i just concerned that the varnish would burn or melt at some future
point but i must admit i live in an apt and puting varnish on the
stove given how flamable it is creeps me out if it were to flash
over i'd be in trouble i'd need a big amout to submerge the
transformer big as a softball or more 100c is 212f thats hot

thanks everybody

If you get transformer varnish, it should handle the temperature quite well.
That's what it's designed to do.
One suggestion that I don't remember anyone making... If the transformer has
screws or bolts holding the whole assembly together, make sure that the nuts are
securely tightened. That will tighten any loose laminations. I've cured a
large number of buzzing transformers this way.

Cheers!!!!

--
Dave M
MasonDG44 at comcast dot net (Just substitute the appropriate characters in the
address)

Some days you're the dog, some days the hydrant.

 

[Ken Weitzel]

DaveM wrote:

"ml" <m@di.net> wrote in message
news:m-72B8A9.16200705012007@news.verizon.net...
In article <pan.2007.01.05.02.34.09.138000@nntp.sun-meatplow.local>,
Meat Plow <meat@meatplow.local> wrote:

On Fri, 05 Jan 2007 02:22:05 +0000, ml Has Frothed:

hi

i have a new properly operating ie not deffective astron (analog) power
supply

naturally even w/no load the transformer makes a bit of a buzz the
usual kind


how do you quite that?

i've seen some transformers in the past completely covered w/metal not
sure if buying such a replacement is practical or if that would 'do ' it

further i presume the transf would get hotter and need additional
cooling ? (astron has no fan)


any tips ?


Both my Astron 25 and 35 buzz. I got used to it.
silly question, a few here suggested coating /soakn' w/varnich or etc

once it's dried does that stuff withstand the temperatures transformers
get up to? this is a 24hr on device


i am also not opposed to simply replacing the transformer i am sure
it's not cheep but don't know transformer speak buzz wise i know the
input/output spec's but what is a 'quite one ' called just a higher
quality one? a super laminated one or one with metal casing around
the unit? are they transformer firms know to be 'quite'?


i can't add 'insulation' around the case as somone suggested thou i like
the idea since it would trap the heat this unit has no fan

i am aware that all the astrons i've seen do buzz this way i just
want to make it quite seems a simple experiment and mod

i tried putting the entire unit onto rubber isolators it didn't
decrease the sound actually seemd to make it louader a drop there
arent' any coils on the ckt board so opening it up i can tell it's just
a transformer issue

it's a 25amp cont supply @13.8vdc (120ac)

if soaking it in varnish or equiv would work that would be ok by me
i just concerned that the varnish would burn or melt at some future
point but i must admit i live in an apt and puting varnish on the
stove given how flamable it is creeps me out if it were to flash
over i'd be in trouble i'd need a big amout to submerge the
transformer big as a softball or more 100c is 212f thats hot

thanks everybody

If you get transformer varnish, it should handle the temperature quite well.
That's what it's designed to do.
One suggestion that I don't remember anyone making... If the transformer has
screws or bolts holding the whole assembly together, make sure that the nuts are
securely tightened. That will tighten any loose laminations. I've cured a
large number of buzzing transformers this way.

Hi...

A further thought if I may. Don't just tighten them up, but rather
experiment a bit with the degree of tightness and combinations on all
four bolts. Play with them (safely) a bit, while it's powered up.

Take care.

Ken

 

[Arfa Daily]

"ml" <m@di.net> wrote in message
news:m-72B8A9.16200705012007@news.verizon.net...

In article <pan.2007.01.05.02.34.09.138000@nntp.sun-meatplow.local>,

i am also not opposed to simply replacing the transformer i am sure
it's not cheep but don't know transformer speak buzz wise i know the
input/output spec's but what is a 'quite one ' called just a higher
quality one? a super laminated one or one with metal casing around
the unit? are they transformer firms know to be 'quite'?


If you get to the point of replacing the transformer, I would suggest going

for a toroidal type. They tend to be physically smaller and lighter than an
E-I lamination tranny for the same VA rating, and they are invariably very
quiet. Whilst not ' cheap ', a suitable replacement should not be an "arm
and a leg" job either.

Arfa

 

[Baron]

ml wrote:

hi

i have a new properly operating ie not deffective astron (analog)
power supply

naturally even w/no load the transformer makes a bit of a buzz the
usual kind


how do you quite that?

i've seen some transformers in the past completely covered w/metal
not
sure if buying such a replacement is practical or if that would 'do
' it

further i presume the transf would get hotter and need
additional
cooling ? (astron has no fan)


any tips ?


tnx

Careful use of superglue on the laminations may help! It certainly
works on smaller ones!

--
Best Regards:
Baron.

 

[default]

On Sat, 06 Jan 2007 22:57:42 +0000, Baron
<baron@linuxmainiac.nospam.net> wrote:

Careful use of superglue on the laminations may help! It certainly
works on smaller ones!

Great idea.

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[ml]

In article <pan.2007.01.05.02.34.09.138000@nntp.sun-meatplow.local>,
Meat Plow <meat@meatplow.local> wrote:

On Fri, 05 Jan 2007 02:22:05 +0000, ml Has Frothed:

hi

i have a new properly operating ie not deffective astron (analog) power
supply

naturally even w/no load the transformer makes a bit of a buzz the
usual kind


how do you quite that?

i've seen some transformers in the past completely covered w/metal not
sure if buying such a replacement is practical or if that would 'do ' it

further i presume the transf would get hotter and need additional
cooling ? (astron has no fan)


any tips ?



Both my Astron 25 and 35 buzz. I got used to it.

silly question, a few here suggested coating /soakn' w/varnich or etc

once it's dried does that stuff withstand the temperatures transformers
get up to? this is a 24hr on device


i am also not opposed to simply replacing the transformer i am sure
it's not cheep but don't know transformer speak buzz wise i know the
input/output spec's but what is a 'quite one ' called just a higher
quality one? a super laminated one or one with metal casing around
the unit? are they transformer firms know to be 'quite'?


i can't add 'insulation' around the case as somone suggested thou i like
the idea since it would trap the heat this unit has no fan

i am aware that all the astrons i've seen do buzz this way i just
want to make it quite seems a simple experiment and mod

i tried putting the entire unit onto rubber isolators it didn't
decrease the sound actually seemd to make it louader a drop there
arent' any coils on the ckt board so opening it up i can tell it's just
a transformer issue

it's a 25amp cont supply @13.8vdc (120ac)

if soaking it in varnish or equiv would work that would be ok by me
i just concerned that the varnish would burn or melt at some future
point but i must admit i live in an apt and puting varnish on the
stove given how flamable it is creeps me out if it were to flash
over i'd be in trouble i'd need a big amout to submerge the
transformer big as a softball or more 100c is 212f thats hot

thanks everybody

 

[kip]

What I have done in the past is to put the Transformer in the Oven
till it gets to the point you need gloves to bring it out.
Get it nice and Hot....
Then submerge the Transformer in the Varnish ,after
say 5 mins remove and hang to dry.

kip

 

[Meat Plow]

On Fri, 05 Jan 2007 21:20:16 +0000, ml Has Frothed:

In article <pan.2007.01.05.02.34.09.138000@nntp.sun-meatplow.local>,
Meat Plow <meat@meatplow.local> wrote:

On Fri, 05 Jan 2007 02:22:05 +0000, ml Has Frothed:

hi

i have a new properly operating ie not deffective astron (analog) power
supply

naturally even w/no load the transformer makes a bit of a buzz the
usual kind


how do you quite that?

i've seen some transformers in the past completely covered w/metal not
sure if buying such a replacement is practical or if that would 'do ' it

further i presume the transf would get hotter and need additional
cooling ? (astron has no fan)


any tips ?



Both my Astron 25 and 35 buzz. I got used to it.

silly question, a few here suggested coating /soakn' w/varnich or etc

once it's dried does that stuff withstand the temperatures transformers
get up to? this is a 24hr on device


i am also not opposed to simply replacing the transformer i am sure
it's not cheep but don't know transformer speak buzz wise i know the
input/output spec's but what is a 'quite one ' called just a higher
quality one? a super laminated one or one with metal casing around
the unit? are they transformer firms know to be 'quite'?


i can't add 'insulation' around the case as somone suggested thou i like
the idea since it would trap the heat this unit has no fan

i am aware that all the astrons i've seen do buzz this way i just
want to make it quite seems a simple experiment and mod

i tried putting the entire unit onto rubber isolators it didn't
decrease the sound actually seemd to make it louader a drop there
arent' any coils on the ckt board so opening it up i can tell it's just
a transformer issue

it's a 25amp cont supply @13.8vdc (120ac)

if soaking it in varnish or equiv would work that would be ok by me
i just concerned that the varnish would burn or melt at some future
point but i must admit i live in an apt and puting varnish on the
stove given how flamable it is creeps me out if it were to flash
over i'd be in trouble i'd need a big amout to submerge the
transformer big as a softball or more 100c is 212f thats hot

thanks everybody

I used mine in my bedroom to power some ham radio gear. I did get used to
it after awhile but ultimately replaced it with a Diamond SMPS that is
whisper quiet. It does have a cooling fan but it is temperature controlled.
Not sure if a coating of varnish would help you. I think the case
amplifies the sound so my first choice would be to find some thin rubber
foam material with adhesive tape on one side and cover the inside case
with it. I wouln't think it would overheat since the heatsink is on the
back.

--
Pierre Salinger Memorial Hook, Line & Sinker, June 2004

COOSN-266-06-25794