Time to Upgrade ?:-}

[Phil Hobbs]

On 08/11/2015 11:32 AM, John Larkin wrote:

On Mon, 10 Aug 2015 19:37:38 -0400, DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno
DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> wrote:

On Mon, 10 Aug 2015 18:19:24 -0500, Les Cargill
lcargill99@comcast.com> Gave us:

Nearly everything runs on Win7 64 bit IME.

Not without signed drivers.

I just transitioned from XP to W7pro 64-bit. Everything works, and
the annoying UI interface changes have been mostly patched up. [1]

Old 16-bit apps won't run.

http://www.dosbox.com/download.php?main=1

Pretty painless, except that ctl-home doesn't get you genuine full
screen mode.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs


--
Dr Philip C D Hobbs
Principal Consultant
ElectroOptical Innovations LLC
Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics

160 North State Road #203
Briarcliff Manor NY 10510

hobbs at electrooptical dot net
http://electrooptical.net

 

On Tuesday, August 11, 2015 at 2:00:46 PM UTC-7, David Brown wrote:

On 11/08/15 18:07, edward.ming.lee@gmail.com wrote:

I was told that our customer's Sybase/SQL server app won't run on 64
bit window. So, we are stuck with 32 bit XP VM on 32 bit Linux PM in
64 bit machine. 64 bit PM also cause problem with 32 bit XP DHCP.


I've never had trouble with 32-bit XP VM's on a 64-bit Linux host, using
VirtualBox for virtualisation.

That part is not the problem. The VM boxes on the host itself work fine. But if your DHCP server is running 64 bit, the XP clients on the network will timeout on DHCP refresh. Identical setup works fine for 32 bit.

>But of course other people's experience may vary - what do you use for the virtualisation?

Yes, VirtualBox on Mint 17.

 

On Tuesday, August 11, 2015 at 3:21:47 PM UTC-7, David Brown wrote:

On 12/08/15 00:15, edward.ming.lee@gmail.com wrote:
On Tuesday, August 11, 2015 at 2:00:46 PM UTC-7, David Brown wrote:
On 11/08/15 18:07, edward.ming.lee@gmail.com wrote:

I was told that our customer's Sybase/SQL server app won't run on
64 bit window. So, we are stuck with 32 bit XP VM on 32 bit
Linux PM in 64 bit machine. 64 bit PM also cause problem with 32
bit XP DHCP.


I've never had trouble with 32-bit XP VM's on a 64-bit Linux host,
using VirtualBox for virtualisation.

That part is not the problem. The VM boxes on the host itself work
fine. But if your DHCP server is running 64 bit, the XP clients on
the network will timeout on DHCP refresh. Identical setup works fine
for 32 bit.

I am not sure I follow you - are you talking about the VirtualBox DHCP
server for NAT network connections when you have 64-bit host and 32-bit
XP clients?

Yes, Linux PM (Physical Machine) with public static IP and private NAT/DHCP.

> That sounds like a sizeable bug in VirtualBox.

It's not really a VirtualBox issue. It's 64 bit Linux with 32 bit XP incompatibility.

> I almost always use bridged networking rather than NAT in VirtualBox, so perhaps that's why I have no problems.

Then we can't have static IP.

 

On Tuesday, August 11, 2015 at 4:08:38 PM UTC-7, David Brown wrote:

On 12/08/15 00:40, edward.ming.lee@gmail.com wrote:
On Tuesday, August 11, 2015 at 3:21:47 PM UTC-7, David Brown wrote:
On 12/08/15 00:15, edward.ming.lee@gmail.com wrote:
On Tuesday, August 11, 2015 at 2:00:46 PM UTC-7, David Brown
wrote:
On 11/08/15 18:07, edward.ming.lee@gmail.com wrote:

I was told that our customer's Sybase/SQL server app won't
run on 64 bit window. So, we are stuck with 32 bit XP VM on
32 bit Linux PM in 64 bit machine. 64 bit PM also cause
problem with 32 bit XP DHCP.


I've never had trouble with 32-bit XP VM's on a 64-bit Linux
host, using VirtualBox for virtualisation.

That part is not the problem. The VM boxes on the host itself
work fine. But if your DHCP server is running 64 bit, the XP
clients on the network will timeout on DHCP refresh. Identical
setup works fine for 32 bit.

I am not sure I follow you - are you talking about the VirtualBox
DHCP server for NAT network connections when you have 64-bit host
and 32-bit XP clients?

Yes, Linux PM (Physical Machine) with public static IP and private
NAT/DHCP.

That sounds like a sizeable bug in VirtualBox.

It's not really a VirtualBox issue. It's 64 bit Linux with 32 bit XP
incompatibility.


This all sounds very strange (I have a 64-bit Linux machine serving DHCP
to dozens of 32-bit XP systems), but I suppose there all sorts of
combinations possible, and this is not really the right place to try and
figure out the problem.

I can easily reproduce the problem. I spent days tracing through the DHCP codes and kernel drivers. At first, i though it was the network driver timing out. But then everything work out fines with 32 bit. For now, we would just stick with 32 bit, until i have time to revisit the problem.

 

[DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUn]

On Tue, 11 Aug 2015 12:01:26 -0700 (PDT), edward.ming.lee@gmail.com Gave
us:

>Sorry, Virtualization.

I do not need a primer on Linux.

 

[David Brown]

On 11/08/15 18:07, edward.ming.lee@gmail.com wrote:

I was told that our customer's Sybase/SQL server app won't run on 64
bit window. So, we are stuck with 32 bit XP VM on 32 bit Linux PM in
64 bit machine. 64 bit PM also cause problem with 32 bit XP DHCP.

I've never had trouble with 32-bit XP VM's on a 64-bit Linux host, using
VirtualBox for virtualisation. But of course other people's experience
may vary - what do you use for the virtualisation?

 

[John Larkin]

On Tue, 11 Aug 2015 12:14:18 -0500, John Fields
<jfields@austininstruments.com> wrote:

On Tue, 11 Aug 2015 08:32:24 -0700, John Larkin
jlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> wrote:

On Mon, 10 Aug 2015 19:37:38 -0400, DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno
DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> wrote:

On Mon, 10 Aug 2015 18:19:24 -0500, Les Cargill <lcargill99@comcast.com
Gave us:

Nearly everything runs on Win7 64 bit IME.

Not without signed drivers.

I just transitioned from XP to W7pro 64-bit. Everything works, and the
annoying UI interface changes have been mostly patched up. [1]

Old 16-bit apps won't run. Old 32-bit stuff works fine. And Google
Earth works again. Could have been a lot worse.

[1] how can I get rid of the "system view" junk on the left side of
Explorer panes?

---
Use Google Chrome instead.

John Fields

I meant the file explorer, not the browser. As if I would ever use IE!

 

[John Fields]

On Tue, 11 Aug 2015 14:36:15 -0700, John Larkin
<jjlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> wrote:

On Tue, 11 Aug 2015 12:14:18 -0500, John Fields
jfields@austininstruments.com> wrote:

On Tue, 11 Aug 2015 08:32:24 -0700, John Larkin
jlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> wrote:

On Mon, 10 Aug 2015 19:37:38 -0400, DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno
DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> wrote:

On Mon, 10 Aug 2015 18:19:24 -0500, Les Cargill <lcargill99@comcast.com
Gave us:

Nearly everything runs on Win7 64 bit IME.

Not without signed drivers.

I just transitioned from XP to W7pro 64-bit. Everything works, and the
annoying UI interface changes have been mostly patched up. [1]

Old 16-bit apps won't run. Old 32-bit stuff works fine. And Google
Earth works again. Could have been a lot worse.

[1] how can I get rid of the "system view" junk on the left side of
Explorer panes?

---
Use Google Chrome instead.

John Fields

I meant the file explorer, not the browser.

---
Then you should have referred to it by its proper name, "Windows
Explorer."
---

>As if I would ever use IE!

---
There's that narcissism showing through again...

 

[David Brown]

On 12/08/15 00:15, edward.ming.lee@gmail.com wrote:

On Tuesday, August 11, 2015 at 2:00:46 PM UTC-7, David Brown wrote:
On 11/08/15 18:07, edward.ming.lee@gmail.com wrote:

I was told that our customer's Sybase/SQL server app won't run on
64 bit window. So, we are stuck with 32 bit XP VM on 32 bit
Linux PM in 64 bit machine. 64 bit PM also cause problem with 32
bit XP DHCP.


I've never had trouble with 32-bit XP VM's on a 64-bit Linux host,
using VirtualBox for virtualisation.

That part is not the problem. The VM boxes on the host itself work
fine. But if your DHCP server is running 64 bit, the XP clients on
the network will timeout on DHCP refresh. Identical setup works fine
for 32 bit.

I am not sure I follow you - are you talking about the VirtualBox DHCP
server for NAT network connections when you have 64-bit host and 32-bit
XP clients? That sounds like a sizeable bug in VirtualBox. I almost
always use bridged networking rather than NAT in VirtualBox, so perhaps
that's why I have no problems.

But of course other people's experience may vary - what do you use
for the virtualisation?

Yes, VirtualBox on Mint 17.

 

[John Larkin]

On Tue, 11 Aug 2015 17:14:20 -0500, John Fields
<jfields@austininstruments.com> wrote:

On Tue, 11 Aug 2015 14:36:15 -0700, John Larkin
jjlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> wrote:

On Tue, 11 Aug 2015 12:14:18 -0500, John Fields
jfields@austininstruments.com> wrote:

On Tue, 11 Aug 2015 08:32:24 -0700, John Larkin
jlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> wrote:

On Mon, 10 Aug 2015 19:37:38 -0400, DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno
DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> wrote:

On Mon, 10 Aug 2015 18:19:24 -0500, Les Cargill <lcargill99@comcast.com
Gave us:

Nearly everything runs on Win7 64 bit IME.

Not without signed drivers.

I just transitioned from XP to W7pro 64-bit. Everything works, and the
annoying UI interface changes have been mostly patched up. [1]

Old 16-bit apps won't run. Old 32-bit stuff works fine. And Google
Earth works again. Could have been a lot worse.

[1] how can I get rid of the "system view" junk on the left side of
Explorer panes?

---
Use Google Chrome instead.

John Fields

I meant the file explorer, not the browser.

---
Then you should have referred to it by its proper name, "Windows
Explorer."

I said that I was running Windows, and I didn't say "Internet
Explorer."

 

[David Brown]

On 12/08/15 00:40, edward.ming.lee@gmail.com wrote:

On Tuesday, August 11, 2015 at 3:21:47 PM UTC-7, David Brown wrote:
On 12/08/15 00:15, edward.ming.lee@gmail.com wrote:
On Tuesday, August 11, 2015 at 2:00:46 PM UTC-7, David Brown
wrote:
On 11/08/15 18:07, edward.ming.lee@gmail.com wrote:

I was told that our customer's Sybase/SQL server app won't
run on 64 bit window. So, we are stuck with 32 bit XP VM on
32 bit Linux PM in 64 bit machine. 64 bit PM also cause
problem with 32 bit XP DHCP.


I've never had trouble with 32-bit XP VM's on a 64-bit Linux
host, using VirtualBox for virtualisation.

That part is not the problem. The VM boxes on the host itself
work fine. But if your DHCP server is running 64 bit, the XP
clients on the network will timeout on DHCP refresh. Identical
setup works fine for 32 bit.

I am not sure I follow you - are you talking about the VirtualBox
DHCP server for NAT network connections when you have 64-bit host
and 32-bit XP clients?

Yes, Linux PM (Physical Machine) with public static IP and private
NAT/DHCP.

That sounds like a sizeable bug in VirtualBox.

It's not really a VirtualBox issue. It's 64 bit Linux with 32 bit XP
incompatibility.

This all sounds very strange (I have a 64-bit Linux machine serving DHCP
to dozens of 32-bit XP systems), but I suppose there all sorts of
combinations possible, and this is not really the right place to try and
figure out the problem.

I almost always use bridged networking rather than NAT in
VirtualBox, so perhaps that's why I have no problems.

Then we can't have static IP.

 

On Tuesday, August 11, 2015 at 7:21:18 PM UTC-7, Phil Hobbs wrote:

On 8/11/2015 5:00 PM, David Brown wrote:
On 11/08/15 18:07, edward.ming.lee@gmail.com wrote:

I was told that our customer's Sybase/SQL server app won't run on 64
bit window. So, we are stuck with 32 bit XP VM on 32 bit Linux PM in
64 bit machine. 64 bit PM also cause problem with 32 bit XP DHCP.


I've never had trouble with 32-bit XP VM's on a 64-bit Linux host, using
VirtualBox for virtualisation. But of course other people's experience
may vary - what do you use for the virtualisation?


XP 32 bit runs fine in Qemu/KVM on CentOS 6.

Yes, it's fine on Mint 17 VM also, but real XP on network timeout on DHCP.

 

[Phil Hobbs]

On 8/11/2015 5:00 PM, David Brown wrote:

On 11/08/15 18:07, edward.ming.lee@gmail.com wrote:

I was told that our customer's Sybase/SQL server app won't run on 64
bit window. So, we are stuck with 32 bit XP VM on 32 bit Linux PM in
64 bit machine. 64 bit PM also cause problem with 32 bit XP DHCP.


I've never had trouble with 32-bit XP VM's on a 64-bit Linux host, using
VirtualBox for virtualisation. But of course other people's experience
may vary - what do you use for the virtualisation?


XP 32 bit runs fine in Qemu/KVM on CentOS 6.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

--
Dr Philip C D Hobbs
Principal Consultant
ElectroOptical Innovations LLC
Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics

160 North State Road #203
Briarcliff Manor NY 10510

hobbs at electrooptical dot net
http://electrooptical.net

 

[John Fields]

On Tue, 11 Aug 2015 15:38:41 -0700, John Larkin
<jjlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> wrote:

On Tue, 11 Aug 2015 17:14:20 -0500, John Fields
jfields@austininstruments.com> wrote:

On Tue, 11 Aug 2015 14:36:15 -0700, John Larkin
jjlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> wrote:

On Tue, 11 Aug 2015 12:14:18 -0500, John Fields
jfields@austininstruments.com> wrote:

On Tue, 11 Aug 2015 08:32:24 -0700, John Larkin
jlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> wrote:

On Mon, 10 Aug 2015 19:37:38 -0400, DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno
DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> wrote:

On Mon, 10 Aug 2015 18:19:24 -0500, Les Cargill <lcargill99@comcast.com
Gave us:

Nearly everything runs on Win7 64 bit IME.

Not without signed drivers.

I just transitioned from XP to W7pro 64-bit. Everything works, and the
annoying UI interface changes have been mostly patched up. [1]

Old 16-bit apps won't run. Old 32-bit stuff works fine. And Google
Earth works again. Could have been a lot worse.

[1] how can I get rid of the "system view" junk on the left side of
Explorer panes?

---
Use Google Chrome instead.

John Fields

I meant the file explorer, not the browser.

---
Then you should have referred to it by its proper name, "Windows
Explorer."

I said that I was running Windows, and I didn't say "Internet
Explorer."

Indeed, but since there were two choices and you defined neither, your
assumption that clarity is inherent in your writing was flawed.

John Fields

 

[John Larkin]

On Thu, 13 Aug 2015 03:13:32 -0500, John Fields
<jfields@austininstruments.com> wrote:

On Tue, 11 Aug 2015 15:38:41 -0700, John Larkin
jjlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> wrote:

On Tue, 11 Aug 2015 17:14:20 -0500, John Fields
jfields@austininstruments.com> wrote:

On Tue, 11 Aug 2015 14:36:15 -0700, John Larkin
jjlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> wrote:

On Tue, 11 Aug 2015 12:14:18 -0500, John Fields
jfields@austininstruments.com> wrote:

On Tue, 11 Aug 2015 08:32:24 -0700, John Larkin
jlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> wrote:

On Mon, 10 Aug 2015 19:37:38 -0400, DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno
DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> wrote:

On Mon, 10 Aug 2015 18:19:24 -0500, Les Cargill <lcargill99@comcast.com
Gave us:

Nearly everything runs on Win7 64 bit IME.

Not without signed drivers.

I just transitioned from XP to W7pro 64-bit. Everything works, and the
annoying UI interface changes have been mostly patched up. [1]

Old 16-bit apps won't run. Old 32-bit stuff works fine. And Google
Earth works again. Could have been a lot worse.

[1] how can I get rid of the "system view" junk on the left side of
Explorer panes?

---
Use Google Chrome instead.

John Fields

I meant the file explorer, not the browser.

---
Then you should have referred to it by its proper name, "Windows
Explorer."

I said that I was running Windows, and I didn't say "Internet
Explorer."

Indeed, but since there were two choices and you defined neither, your
assumption that clarity is inherent in your writing was flawed.

John Fields

You keep getting crazier.


--

John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc
lunatic fringe electronics

jlarkin att highlandtechnology dott com
http://www.highlandtechnology.com

 

[Lasse Langwadt Christense]

Den torsdag den 13. august 2015 kl. 22.24.27 UTC+2 skrev Don Y:

On 8/13/2015 1:08 PM, Jim Thompson wrote:

Those are the moments that make engineering *fun*. Not building
a faster/cheaper/smaller/bigger version of last year's product, etc.
But, it puts a lot of people "off" -- there's more risk, more uncertainty,
more to LEARN...

That's why I'm having so much fun... I just love it when some schmuck
says, "Can't be done!" I think I learn _at_least_ one new trick a
day!

Sadly (IMO), there are too many folks who either aren't given the
opportunity to "play outside the box" (because it isn't in the
economic interests of their employer) *or* who are afraid to
do so (possibly fear of failure?) *or*, worst, NOT INTERESTED!

(why didn't these folks go into something like ACCOUNTING or
DITCH DIGGING??)

playing outside the box can probably be well rewarded in accounting,
until you get caught

-Lasse

 

[John Fields]

On Thu, 13 Aug 2015 07:10:37 -0700, John Larkin
<jlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> wrote:

On Thu, 13 Aug 2015 03:13:32 -0500, John Fields
jfields@austininstruments.com> wrote:

On Tue, 11 Aug 2015 15:38:41 -0700, John Larkin
jjlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> wrote:

On Tue, 11 Aug 2015 17:14:20 -0500, John Fields
jfields@austininstruments.com> wrote:

On Tue, 11 Aug 2015 14:36:15 -0700, John Larkin
jjlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> wrote:

On Tue, 11 Aug 2015 12:14:18 -0500, John Fields
jfields@austininstruments.com> wrote:

On Tue, 11 Aug 2015 08:32:24 -0700, John Larkin
jlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> wrote:

On Mon, 10 Aug 2015 19:37:38 -0400, DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno
DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> wrote:

On Mon, 10 Aug 2015 18:19:24 -0500, Les Cargill <lcargill99@comcast.com
Gave us:

Nearly everything runs on Win7 64 bit IME.

Not without signed drivers.

I just transitioned from XP to W7pro 64-bit. Everything works, and the
annoying UI interface changes have been mostly patched up. [1]

Old 16-bit apps won't run. Old 32-bit stuff works fine. And Google
Earth works again. Could have been a lot worse.

[1] how can I get rid of the "system view" junk on the left side of
Explorer panes?

---
Use Google Chrome instead.

John Fields

I meant the file explorer, not the browser.

---
Then you should have referred to it by its proper name, "Windows
Explorer."

I said that I was running Windows, and I didn't say "Internet
Explorer."

Indeed, but since there were two choices and you defined neither, your
assumption that clarity is inherent in your writing was flawed.

John Fields

You keep getting crazier.

---
Crazy is fun when designing new stuff, something stable old you
wouldn't know anything about.

John Fields

 

[Don Y]

On 8/13/2015 12:35 PM, John Fields wrote:

Crazy is fun when designing new stuff, something stable old you
wouldn't know anything about.

Fun is designing new stuff in CRAZY (unconventional) ways;
not buying into the boring/conventional set of assumptions
but, rather, thinking outside the *globe* (i.e., not "box").

I worked with a firm that designed electronic door locks. No
wires *to* the door (power or signal!) keeps installation costs
low.

No "antenna" in the door/lock.

Yet, the locks could be reprogrammed at will -- for no
"extra"/special labor costs ("rekeying" is expensive in
hotels, large businesses, etc. "Bob was fired today.
But, he didn't turn in his keys! Get someone in here to
rekey the locks to which he had access..." or "The guest
in room 2701 took their key when they checked out. We've
billed their account. But, need to make sure they don't
let themselves back into the room now that its being rented
to another party").

"Can't be done!"
"Of COURSE it can! *Here* it is!"
"Ahhhh... but... Hmmm, that's clever!"

Those are the moments that make engineering *fun*. Not building
a faster/cheaper/smaller/bigger version of last year's product, etc.
But, it puts a lot of people "off" -- there's more risk, more uncertainty,
more to LEARN...

 

[Jim Thompson]

On Thu, 13 Aug 2015 13:02:02 -0700, Don Y <this@is.not.me.com> wrote:

On 8/13/2015 12:35 PM, John Fields wrote:

Crazy is fun when designing new stuff, something stable old you
wouldn't know anything about.

Fun is designing new stuff in CRAZY (unconventional) ways;
not buying into the boring/conventional set of assumptions
but, rather, thinking outside the *globe* (i.e., not "box").

I worked with a firm that designed electronic door locks. No
wires *to* the door (power or signal!) keeps installation costs
low.

No "antenna" in the door/lock.

Yet, the locks could be reprogrammed at will -- for no
"extra"/special labor costs ("rekeying" is expensive in
hotels, large businesses, etc. "Bob was fired today.
But, he didn't turn in his keys! Get someone in here to
rekey the locks to which he had access..." or "The guest
in room 2701 took their key when they checked out. We've
billed their account. But, need to make sure they don't
let themselves back into the room now that its being rented
to another party").

"Can't be done!"
"Of COURSE it can! *Here* it is!"
"Ahhhh... but... Hmmm, that's clever!"

Those are the moments that make engineering *fun*. Not building
a faster/cheaper/smaller/bigger version of last year's product, etc.
But, it puts a lot of people "off" -- there's more risk, more uncertainty,
more to LEARN...

That's why I'm having so much fun... I just love it when some schmuck
says, "Can't be done!" I think I learn _at_least_ one new trick a
day!

...Jim Thompson
--
| James E.Thompson | mens |
| Analog Innovations | et |
| Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus |
| San Tan Valley, AZ 85142 Skype: skypeanalog | |
| Voice480)460-2350 Fax: Available upon request | Brass Rat |
| E-mail Icon at http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 |

I love to cook with wine. Sometimes I even put it in the food.

 

[Don Y]

On 8/13/2015 1:08 PM, Jim Thompson wrote:

Those are the moments that make engineering *fun*. Not building
a faster/cheaper/smaller/bigger version of last year's product, etc.
But, it puts a lot of people "off" -- there's more risk, more uncertainty,
more to LEARN...

That's why I'm having so much fun... I just love it when some schmuck
says, "Can't be done!" I think I learn _at_least_ one new trick a
day!

Sadly (IMO), there are too many folks who either aren't given the
opportunity to "play outside the box" (because it isn't in the
economic interests of their employer) *or* who are afraid to
do so (possibly fear of failure?) *or*, worst, NOT INTERESTED!

(why didn't these folks go into something like ACCOUNTING or
DITCH DIGGING??)