OT: dial-up "response"

R

Robert Baer

Guest
Trying to download something larger than 2Meg; used to be possible
but recently not.
Observtions: short 100-300mSec burst or bursts incoming followed by
1-20sec no data transfer; repeats until line drops out for no apparent
reason.
Solutions other than unobtainable high speed connection?
 
"Robert Baer" <robertbaer@localnet.com> wrote in message
news:Z5adnaGlbNXikEXUnZ2dnUVZ_hqWnZ2d@posted.localnet...
Trying to download something larger than 2Meg; used to be possible but
recently not.
Observtions: short 100-300mSec burst or bursts incoming followed by
1-20sec no data transfer; repeats until line drops out for no apparent
reason.
Solutions other than unobtainable high speed connection?
Click to expand...
Probably a noisy phone line on your end, or a bad modem or other problem at
your ISP. I have dial-up and had this problem sometimes, and I could hear
static when I picked up a phone on the same line. This happened for a while
after rainy spells, so probably water in the cable. There were also vines
growing around and into the junction box on the pole. About like this:

http://www.smart.net/~pstech/PowerJungle03_200807.jpg
http://www.smart.net/~pstech/PowerJungle04_200807.jpg
http://www.smart.net/~pstech/PowerJungle07_200807.jpg

Finally I experienced a close lightning strike that caused more visible
damage, and the Telco replaced the line. The arc apparently traveled down a
large sycamore tree until it reached a power line, where it arced into the
neutral, and causing a fireball that broke the window and got into the
nearby phone line. I was working on my computer about 50 feet away, and I
could smell ozone after the flash-bang.

http://www.smart.net/~pstech/Lightning/Lightning038.JPG
http://www.smart.net/~pstech/Lightning/Lightning039.JPG
http://www.smart.net/~pstech/Lightning/Lightning040.JPG
http://www.smart.net/~pstech/Lightning/Lightning041.JPG

Paul
 
"Robert Baer" <robertbaer@localnet.com> wrote in message
news:Z5adnaGlbNXikEXUnZ2dnUVZ_hqWnZ2d@posted.localnet...
Trying to download something larger than 2Meg; used to be possible
but recently not.
Observtions: short 100-300mSec burst or bursts incoming followed by
1-20sec no data transfer; repeats until line drops out for no apparent
reason.
Solutions other than unobtainable high speed connection?
Click to expand...
If you can hear static on the line. I would Call the Phone company and
open a ticket for static on the line.
Worked for my DSL problems.

Cheers
 
Robert Baer wrote:
Trying to download something larger than 2Meg; used to be possible but
recently not.
Observtions: short 100-300mSec burst or bursts incoming followed by
1-20sec no data transfer; repeats until line drops out for no apparent
reason.
Click to expand...
Sounds like you have prehistoric hardware of some sort and buffer
overrun problems. What do the diagnostics say for the connection?

It would be easier to give sensible advice if you posted in one of the
modem groups with specific after call diagnostics from the modem.

Solutions other than unobtainable high speed connection?
Click to expand...
Better RS232 or modem drivers and chips with enhanced buffering.

I thought these days it would be hard to find any lacking these
features. The 16550 became very popular when modems reached 56k because
it became possible for the download speed to exceed what DOS or 'Doze
could accept reliably. OS/2 could simulate IO buffering in the device
driver.

Regards,
Martin Brown
 
On Apr 4, 9:46 pm, Robert Baer <robertb...@localnet.com> wrote:
Trying to download something larger than 2Meg; used to be possible
but recently not.
Observtions: short 100-300mSec burst or bursts incoming followed by
1-20sec no data transfer; repeats until line drops out for no apparent
reason.
Solutions other than unobtainable high speed connection?
Click to expand...
Can you query the modem for line quality? It might tell you something.
 
Paul E. Schoen wrote:
"Robert Baer" <robertbaer@localnet.com> wrote in message
news:Z5adnaGlbNXikEXUnZ2dnUVZ_hqWnZ2d@posted.localnet...

Trying to download something larger than 2Meg; used to be possible but
recently not.
Observtions: short 100-300mSec burst or bursts incoming followed by
1-20sec no data transfer; repeats until line drops out for no apparent
reason.
Solutions other than unobtainable high speed connection?


Probably a noisy phone line on your end, or a bad modem or other problem at
your ISP. I have dial-up and had this problem sometimes, and I could hear
static when I picked up a phone on the same line. This happened for a while
after rainy spells, so probably water in the cable. There were also vines
growing around and into the junction box on the pole. About like this:

http://www.smart.net/~pstech/PowerJungle03_200807.jpg
http://www.smart.net/~pstech/PowerJungle04_200807.jpg
http://www.smart.net/~pstech/PowerJungle07_200807.jpg

Finally I experienced a close lightning strike that caused more visible
damage, and the Telco replaced the line. The arc apparently traveled down a
large sycamore tree until it reached a power line, where it arced into the
neutral, and causing a fireball that broke the window and got into the
nearby phone line. I was working on my computer about 50 feet away, and I
could smell ozone after the flash-bang.

http://www.smart.net/~pstech/Lightning/Lightning038.JPG
http://www.smart.net/~pstech/Lightning/Lightning039.JPG
http://www.smart.net/~pstech/Lightning/Lightning040.JPG
http://www.smart.net/~pstech/Lightning/Lightning041.JPG

Paul


I think the drop-out is due to the line; and the "deadtime" might be
Click to expand...
the ISP.
Too bad there is no free ISP for testing...
I changed modem drivers as suggested by my ISP to no avai; a
different OS not previously used for online work also had same problems.
Cannot FTP upload due to similar problems (timeout mentioned in this
case).
 
Martin Riddle wrote:

"Robert Baer" <robertbaer@localnet.com> wrote in message
news:Z5adnaGlbNXikEXUnZ2dnUVZ_hqWnZ2d@posted.localnet...

Trying to download something larger than 2Meg; used to be possible
but recently not.
Observtions: short 100-300mSec burst or bursts incoming followed by
1-20sec no data transfer; repeats until line drops out for no apparent
reason.
Solutions other than unobtainable high speed connection?


If you can hear static on the line. I would Call the Phone company and
open a ticket for static on the line.
Worked for my DSL problems.

Cheers



I may try that.
Click to expand...
Thanks.
 
a7yvm109gf5d1@netzero.com wrote:

On Apr 4, 9:46 pm, Robert Baer <robertb...@localnet.com> wrote:

Trying to download something larger than 2Meg; used to be possible
but recently not.
Observtions: short 100-300mSec burst or bursts incoming followed by
1-20sec no data transfer; repeats until line drops out for no apparent
reason.
Solutions other than unobtainable high speed connection?


Can you query the modem for line quality? It might tell you something.
Good question; what are the Hayes protocol commands for that?
Click to expand...
 
Martin Brown wrote:

Robert Baer wrote:

Trying to download something larger than 2Meg; used to be possible
but recently not.
Observtions: short 100-300mSec burst or bursts incoming followed by
1-20sec no data transfer; repeats until line drops out for no apparent
reason.


Sounds like you have prehistoric hardware of some sort and buffer
overrun problems. What do the diagnostics say for the connection?

It would be easier to give sensible advice if you posted in one of the
modem groups with specific after call diagnostics from the modem.

Solutions other than unobtainable high speed connection?


Better RS232 or modem drivers and chips with enhanced buffering.

I thought these days it would be hard to find any lacking these
features. The 16550 became very popular when modems reached 56k because
it became possible for the download speed to exceed what DOS or 'Doze
could accept reliably. OS/2 could simulate IO buffering in the device
driver.

Regards,
Martin Brown
Nominally before the problem(s), the datarate was 45K but have seen
Click to expand...
download rates in the 60-80K region for minutes.
 
On 2009-04-05, Robert Baer <robertbaer@localnet.com> wrote:
Trying to download something larger than 2Meg; used to be possible
but recently not.
Observtions: short 100-300mSec burst or bursts incoming followed by
1-20sec no data transfer; repeats until line drops out for no apparent
reason.
Click to expand...
some things to try:

1: test bandwidth to the other end of the PPP link

(eg: send a ping flood)

2: check line quality

after disconnecting from the ISP
connect a teminal emulator (software) to your modem.
and enter AT&V1

eg:
OK
at&V1
TERMINATION REASON.......... NONE
LAST TX rate................ 24000 BPS
HIGHEST TX rate............. 24000 BPS
LAST RX rate................ 45333 BPS
HIGHEST RX rate............. 45333 BPS
PROTOCOL.................... LAPM
COMPRESSION................. V42Bis
Line QUALITY................ 026
Rx LEVEL.................... 018
Highest Rx State............ 83
Highest TX State............ 87
EQM Sum..................... 00D4
RBS Pattern................. 00
Rate Drop................... 00
Digital Loss................ 2000
Local Rtrn Count............ 00
Remote Rtrn Count........... 00
V90

3: complain

4: try a different provider.
 
On 2009-04-05, Robert Baer <robertbaer@localnet.com> wrote:
a7yvm109gf5d1@netzero.com wrote:

On Apr 4, 9:46 pm, Robert Baer <robertb...@localnet.com> wrote:

Trying to download something larger than 2Meg; used to be possible
but recently not.
Observtions: short 100-300mSec burst or bursts incoming followed by
1-20sec no data transfer; repeats until line drops out for no apparent
reason.
Solutions other than unobtainable high speed connection?


Can you query the modem for line quality? It might tell you something.
Good question; what are the Hayes protocol commands for that?
Click to expand...

(after terminating, or interrupting, the call)
at&v1
 
Robert Baer wrote:
a7yvm109gf5d1@netzero.com wrote:

On Apr 4, 9:46 pm, Robert Baer <robertb...@localnet.com> wrote:

Trying to download something larger than 2Meg; used to be possible
but recently not.
Observtions: short 100-300mSec burst or bursts incoming followed by
1-20sec no data transfer; repeats until line drops out for no apparent
reason.
Solutions other than unobtainable high speed connection?

Can you query the modem for line quality? It might tell you something.

Good question; what are the Hayes protocol commands for that?
Click to expand...
RTFM. Look at the FAQs for the modem groups.

The delay is caused by your modem spitting out bytes of compressible
material at your computer faster than the computer can cope. The overrun
generates a cascade failure whereby data is lost, the ISP backs off and
retries exponentially until you drop the connection. Line noise can make
the situation even worse if speed renegotiation occurs as well.

Without the &V1 diagnostics it is a stab in the dark. And even with them
it is necessary to know the chipset and revision level. Ask in the modem
groups - there must be some other poor souls there still on dialup.

Regards,
Martin Brown
 
Jasen Betts wrote:

On 2009-04-05, Robert Baer <robertbaer@localnet.com> wrote:

Trying to download something larger than 2Meg; used to be possible
but recently not.
Observtions: short 100-300mSec burst or bursts incoming followed by
1-20sec no data transfer; repeats until line drops out for no apparent
reason.


some things to try:

1: test bandwidth to the other end of the PPP link

(eg: send a ping flood)

2: check line quality

after disconnecting from the ISP
connect a teminal emulator (software) to your modem.
and enter AT&V1

eg:
OK
at&V1
TERMINATION REASON.......... NONE
LAST TX rate................ 24000 BPS
HIGHEST TX rate............. 24000 BPS
LAST RX rate................ 45333 BPS
HIGHEST RX rate............. 45333 BPS
PROTOCOL.................... LAPM
COMPRESSION................. V42Bis
Line QUALITY................ 026
Rx LEVEL.................... 018
Highest Rx State............ 83
Highest TX State............ 87
EQM Sum..................... 00D4
RBS Pattern................. 00
Rate Drop................... 00
Digital Loss................ 2000
Local Rtrn Count............ 00
Remote Rtrn Count........... 00
V90

3: complain

4: try a different provider.

Googled "connection testing"..Results:
Click to expand...
1) BandwidthPlace.com
screen went to "testing" and nothing happened; after about 5 minutes
the line dropped out.

2) DSLreports.com
selected most simple-minded version of mobile speed tests, 50Kb/s; got:
31Kb/sec 15Kb/sec 4kb/sec 11Kb/sec
0.738 -2.041 0.775 0.915 latency
13.428sec 27.583sec 89.744sec 35.770sec d/l

3) Speakeasy.net
* two minutes to populate home page; clearly not for dial-up!
* click on first >>> icon; get meter that stays at zero; line dropped
after about 3 minutes and a screen with no meter.

4) Ping localnet.com --> nothing for 2 minutes; i quit in disgust.
 
Martin Brown wrote:

Robert Baer wrote:

a7yvm109gf5d1@netzero.com wrote:

On Apr 4, 9:46 pm, Robert Baer <robertb...@localnet.com> wrote:

Trying to download something larger than 2Meg; used to be possible
but recently not.
Observtions: short 100-300mSec burst or bursts incoming followed by
1-20sec no data transfer; repeats until line drops out for no apparent
reason.
Solutions other than unobtainable high speed connection?


Can you query the modem for line quality? It might tell you something.


Good question; what are the Hayes protocol commands for that?


RTFM. Look at the FAQs for the modem groups.

The delay is caused by your modem spitting out bytes of compressible
material at your computer faster than the computer can cope. The overrun
generates a cascade failure whereby data is lost, the ISP backs off and
retries exponentially until you drop the connection. Line noise can make
the situation even worse if speed renegotiation occurs as well.

Without the &V1 diagnostics it is a stab in the dark. And even with them
it is necessary to know the chipset and revision level. Ask in the modem
groups - there must be some other poor souls there still on dialup.

Regards,
Martin Brown
It is only recently that i have has this problem and i have changed
Click to expand...
nothing.
My COM1 port is configured to 115Kbaud.
Both facts argue that the problem is not due to "modem spitting out
bytes of compressible material at your computer faster than the computer
can cope".
 
Jasen Betts wrote:

On 2009-04-05, Robert Baer <robertbaer@localnet.com> wrote:

Trying to download something larger than 2Meg; used to be possible
but recently not.
Observtions: short 100-300mSec burst or bursts incoming followed by
1-20sec no data transfer; repeats until line drops out for no apparent
reason.


some things to try:

1: test bandwidth to the other end of the PPP link

(eg: send a ping flood)

2: check line quality

after disconnecting from the ISP
connect a teminal emulator (software) to your modem.
and enter AT&V1

eg:
OK
at&V1
TERMINATION REASON.......... NONE
LAST TX rate................ 24000 BPS
HIGHEST TX rate............. 24000 BPS
LAST RX rate................ 45333 BPS
HIGHEST RX rate............. 45333 BPS
PROTOCOL.................... LAPM
COMPRESSION................. V42Bis
Line QUALITY................ 026
Rx LEVEL.................... 018
Highest Rx State............ 83
Highest TX State............ 87
EQM Sum..................... 00D4
RBS Pattern................. 00
Rate Drop................... 00
Digital Loss................ 2000
Local Rtrn Count............ 00
Remote Rtrn Count........... 00
V90

3: complain

4: try a different provider.

Thanks; will try that AT&V1 trick.
Click to expand...
 
Robert Baer wrote:
Martin Brown wrote:

Robert Baer wrote:

a7yvm109gf5d1@netzero.com wrote:

On Apr 4, 9:46 pm, Robert Baer <robertb...@localnet.com> wrote:

Trying to download something larger than 2Meg; used to be possible
but recently not.
Observtions: short 100-300mSec burst or bursts incoming followed by
1-20sec no data transfer; repeats until line drops out for no apparent
reason.
Solutions other than unobtainable high speed connection?


Can you query the modem for line quality? It might tell you something.

Good question; what are the Hayes protocol commands for that?

RTFM. Look at the FAQs for the modem groups.

The delay is caused by your modem spitting out bytes of compressible
material at your computer faster than the computer can cope. The
overrun generates a cascade failure whereby data is lost, the ISP
backs off and retries exponentially until you drop the connection.
Line noise can make the situation even worse if speed renegotiation
occurs as well.

Without the &V1 diagnostics it is a stab in the dark. And even with
them it is necessary to know the chipset and revision level. Ask in
the modem groups - there must be some other poor souls there still on
dialup.

Regards,
Martin Brown
It is only recently that i have has this problem and i have changed
nothing.
My COM1 port is configured to 115Kbaud.
Click to expand...
Good heavens and old style COM1 port at 115k and an external modem. That
*can* be maxed out with a decent V.90 connection and some types of web
HTML (or certain types of text file). Internal modems have better
buffering and these days are very cheap standard items.

What RS232 chipset, what buffering enabled and what driver?

Both facts argue that the problem is not due to "modem spitting out
bytes of compressible material at your computer faster than the computer
can cope".
Click to expand...
It could also be a retrain problem. But you would be much better off
asking these questions in a US modem group.

Regards,
Martin Brown
 
Martin Brown wrote:

Robert Baer wrote:

Martin Brown wrote:

Robert Baer wrote:

a7yvm109gf5d1@netzero.com wrote:

On Apr 4, 9:46 pm, Robert Baer <robertb...@localnet.com> wrote:

Trying to download something larger than 2Meg; used to be possible
but recently not.
Observtions: short 100-300mSec burst or bursts incoming followed by
1-20sec no data transfer; repeats until line drops out for no
apparent
reason.
Solutions other than unobtainable high speed connection?



Can you query the modem for line quality? It might tell you something.


Good question; what are the Hayes protocol commands for that?


RTFM. Look at the FAQs for the modem groups.

The delay is caused by your modem spitting out bytes of compressible
material at your computer faster than the computer can cope. The
overrun generates a cascade failure whereby data is lost, the ISP
backs off and retries exponentially until you drop the connection.
Line noise can make the situation even worse if speed renegotiation
occurs as well.

Without the &V1 diagnostics it is a stab in the dark. And even with
them it is necessary to know the chipset and revision level. Ask in
the modem groups - there must be some other poor souls there still on
dialup.

Regards,
Martin Brown

It is only recently that i have has this problem and i have changed
nothing.
My COM1 port is configured to 115Kbaud.


Good heavens and old style COM1 port at 115k and an external modem. That
*can* be maxed out with a decent V.90 connection and some types of web
HTML (or certain types of text file). Internal modems have better
buffering and these days are very cheap standard items.

What RS232 chipset, what buffering enabled and what driver?

Both facts argue that the problem is not due to "modem spitting out
bytes of compressible material at your computer faster than the
computer can cope".


It could also be a retrain problem. But you would be much better off
asking these questions in a US modem group.

Regards,
Martin Brown
chipset?? it is part of an ASIC on the motherboard (by ASUS).
Click to expand...
Driver is most recent from US Robotics.
BUT...
*All* of it worked for years until recently (went bad around April 1).
 
"Robert Baer" <robertbaer@localnet.com> wrote in message
news:n8OdnRM6QsSkekfUnZ2dnUVZ_s6dnZ2d@posted.localnet...
chipset?? it is part of an ASIC on the motherboard (by ASUS).
Driver is most recent from US Robotics.
BUT...
*All* of it worked for years until recently (went bad around April 1).
Click to expand...
Maybe you got the worm...

Paul
 
Robert Baer wrote:
Martin Brown wrote:

Robert Baer wrote:

Martin Brown wrote:

Robert Baer wrote:

a7yvm109gf5d1@netzero.com wrote:

On Apr 4, 9:46 pm, Robert Baer <robertb...@localnet.com> wrote:

Trying to download something larger than 2Meg; used to be possible
but recently not.
Observtions: short 100-300mSec burst or bursts incoming
followed by
1-20sec no data transfer; repeats until line drops out for no
apparent
reason.
Solutions other than unobtainable high speed connection?



Can you query the modem for line quality? It might tell you
something.


Good question; what are the Hayes protocol commands for that?


RTFM. Look at the FAQs for the modem groups.

The delay is caused by your modem spitting out bytes of compressible
material at your computer faster than the computer can cope. The
overrun generates a cascade failure whereby data is lost, the ISP
backs off and retries exponentially until you drop the connection.
Line noise can make the situation even worse if speed renegotiation
occurs as well.

Without the &V1 diagnostics it is a stab in the dark. And even with
them it is necessary to know the chipset and revision level. Ask in
the modem groups - there must be some other poor souls there still
on dialup.

Regards,
Martin Brown

It is only recently that i have has this problem and i have changed
nothing.
My COM1 port is configured to 115Kbaud.


Good heavens and old style COM1 port at 115k and an external modem.
That *can* be maxed out with a decent V.90 connection and some types
of web HTML (or certain types of text file). Internal modems have
better buffering and these days are very cheap standard items.

What RS232 chipset, what buffering enabled and what driver?

Both facts argue that the problem is not due to "modem spitting out
bytes of compressible material at your computer faster than the
computer can cope".


It could also be a retrain problem. But you would be much better off
asking these questions in a US modem group.

Regards,
Martin Brown

chipset?? it is part of an ASIC on the motherboard (by ASUS).
Driver is most recent from US Robotics.
Click to expand...
I am trying to establish just how prehistoric your setup is. You appear
determined not to provide enough information to make diagnosis easy.

BUT...
*All* of it worked for years until recently (went bad around April 1).
Click to expand...
There is a possibility that you have a virus that is saturating your
limited bandwidth connection. Do you have current AV and fully patched
OS? Also possible your ISP finally worked out how to enable compression.

You could always move to ISDN if you are stuck on dialup for the
forseeable future. That gives you 64k per line (128k bonded) of raw data
and more with compression - a worthwhile improvement over any 56k modem.

One thing you could try is disabling fall forward on the modem to see if
it is a line noise related speed negotiation problem or alternatively
force a connection at a more conservative data rate. Not sure how much
tweaking of the modem S registers is allowed in the US region.

Regards,
Martin Brown
 
Paul E. Schoen wrote:
"Robert Baer" <robertbaer@localnet.com> wrote in message
news:n8OdnRM6QsSkekfUnZ2dnUVZ_s6dnZ2d@posted.localnet...

chipset?? it is part of an ASIC on the motherboard (by ASUS).
Driver is most recent from US Robotics.
BUT...
*All* of it worked for years until recently (went bad around April 1).


Maybe you got the worm...

Paul


I *finally* was able to get another ISP on a free trial basis....
Click to expand...
.....WORKS FINE!
...so it seems that localnet.com has problems on their end...
 
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