Driver to drive?

On Sun, 06 May 2012 16:45:30 -0700, josephkk wrote:

I prefer to look in the mirror when
i wash my face.
I find that pointless. My eyes are full of soap ;-)

--
"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence
over public relations, for nature cannot be fooled."
(Richard Feynman)
 
Les Cargill wrote:
Michael A. Terrell wrote:

Les Cargill wrote:

When people who don't have a lot of savings go out of the job market,
they go on disability. We can't shoot 'em...


Fuck you. I ended up on disability a couple years before retirement
because my health failed. I spent my life savings over three years and
went hungry for a while, before I filed. No one was going to hire
anyone in my condition, and the VA approved my disability so fast that
no one could believe it.

They should have, sounds like. That's not what I am talking about.

I have had a LOT of crap from people lately, about my health & being
on disability. :(


The letter granting disability stated that it
was obvious that I would never be able to work again. Do you really
think that I want to scrape by on $1021 a month, instead of being able
to work? You should try it sometime, before you spout off. Then you
can see what it's like to go without anything more than the basics.
Hoping that a 15 year old truck will run for a few more years. Spending
a lot of time changing dressings on two year old wounds and needing
medical care that you can't afford. How would you like blood, puss and
plasma running down your legs daily, for years? Doctors telling you
that 'You aren't old enough to have that problem' when you've coped with
it for a decade, or more.


Where did anything I wrote apply to you? You have an obvious diability.
I'd say the system worked, with a handful of horror stories to
go along with it.

10 years of crap from people who don't know what's going on, and
doctors making things worse isn't working for me. The constant lack of
sleep makes me irritable, and easy to tick off.

I apologize for my reply, but you have no idea what it's like, if you
haven't lived through it.

I know a lot of people on disability and every one of them would love
to be able to go back to work. I know there are deadbeats & losers, but
not among the people I know. Add to that, idiots who slam a door in you
face, even though they see you walking with a cane or walker. People
who jump in line in front of you, or blow their horn then scream and
curse at you to "Get the hell out of my way' because 'You're walking to
damn slow!!!' To have idiots fly through a stop sign in a parking lot
and miss you by inches, or steer towards you, so you have to have to
dive between parked cars to keep from being hit. It gets old, really
fast.

How would you like some teenage punk assault you, just because you
need a cane to walk? It happened to me a few years ago.


--
You can't have a sense of humor, if you have no sense.
 
dagmargoodboat@yahoo.com wrote:
On May 2, 3:41 pm, "Michael A. Terrell" <mike.terr...@earthlink.net
wrote:
Les Cargill wrote:

When people who don't have a lot of savings go out of the job market,
they go on disability. We can't shoot 'em...

Fuck you. I ended up on disability a couple years before retirement
because my health failed.

Michael, I'm proud to work a little longer and pay a little more.
You're the kind of guy we want to help.

Thank you. I was always willing to help people in need, whenever I
could. I still do what I can, but it's not much compared to what I used
to be able to do.


I'm surrounded by people who compete with you for that same pool of
money who are able-bodied, yet who simply don't want to work.

They need to bring back the CCC, the WPA and Workfare. If they are
able to work, they have to or forfeit any help. Ohio tried to institute
WOrkfare at one time, and was forced to stop. There is always something
that needs done, and they can do something, even if it's pushing a big
broom to clean the streets.


--
You can't have a sense of humor, if you have no sense.
 
On Sun, 6 May 2012 17:28:48 +0100, "Ian Field"
<gangprobing.alien@ntlworld.com> wrote:

I have 100 100s and >200 60s. That's stock for home use.
That's due to the fact that you are a carbon retard.

Goddamned cross posting retards.

The $50 LED bulb will last 20 years.

That alone would pay for it, but it also pays for itself in energy
savings.

You are dumber than dogshit.

There are even LED based spotlights out there that beat the
incandescents. ESPECIALLY on power. But also brightness.

Face it, hot filaments are all but dead.
 
Michael A. Terrell wrote:
Les Cargill wrote:

Michael A. Terrell wrote:

Les Cargill wrote:

When people who don't have a lot of savings go out of the job market,
they go on disability. We can't shoot 'em...


Fuck you. I ended up on disability a couple years before retirement
because my health failed. I spent my life savings over three years and
went hungry for a while, before I filed. No one was going to hire
anyone in my condition, and the VA approved my disability so fast that
no one could believe it.

They should have, sounds like. That's not what I am talking about.


I have had a LOT of crap from people lately, about my health& being
on disability. :(
yeah, I don't understand that. I see it too.

The letter granting disability stated that it
was obvious that I would never be able to work again. Do you really
think that I want to scrape by on $1021 a month, instead of being able
to work? You should try it sometime, before you spout off. Then you
can see what it's like to go without anything more than the basics.
Hoping that a 15 year old truck will run for a few more years. Spending
a lot of time changing dressings on two year old wounds and needing
medical care that you can't afford. How would you like blood, puss and
plasma running down your legs daily, for years? Doctors telling you
that 'You aren't old enough to have that problem' when you've coped with
it for a decade, or more.


Where did anything I wrote apply to you? You have an obvious diability.
I'd say the system worked, with a handful of horror stories to
go along with it.


10 years of crap from people who don't know what's going on, and
doctors making things worse isn't working for me. The constant lack of
sleep makes me irritable, and easy to tick off.
Clearly! :)

I apologize for my reply, but you have no idea what it's like, if you
haven't lived through it.
No, I haven't. No apology necessary.

I know a lot of people on disability and every one of them would love
to be able to go back to work. I know there are deadbeats& losers, but
not among the people I know.
Exactly.

Add to that, idiots who slam a door in you
face, even though they see you walking with a cane or walker. People
who jump in line in front of you, or blow their horn then scream and
curse at you to "Get the hell out of my way' because 'You're walking to
damn slow!!!' To have idiots fly through a stop sign in a parking lot
and miss you by inches, or steer towards you, so you have to have to
dive between parked cars to keep from being hit. It gets old, really
fast.
People pretty much seem to drift through public spaces in a fog.

How would you like some teenage punk assault you, just because you
need a cane to walk? It happened to me a few years ago.
Grrr! Makes me thing a long, duster-style coat and a 12 gauge is in
order, but that's probably illegal in places.


--
Les Cargill
 
On 5/6/2012 3:45 PM, Chieftain of the Carpet Crawlers wrote:
On Sun, 6 May 2012 17:28:48 +0100, "Ian Field"
gangprobing.alien@ntlworld.com> wrote:

I have 100 100s and>200 60s. That's stock for home use.

That's due to the fact that you are a carbon retard.
And you are a carbon failure. Nature screwed up with you.

The $50 LED bulb will last 20 years.

They haven't been around for 20 years, AlwaysWrong.


That alone would pay for it, but it also pays for itself in energy
savings.

You are dumber than dogshit.
But smarter than you.

There are even LED based spotlights out there that beat the
incandescents. ESPECIALLY on power. But also brightness.

Face it, hot filaments are all but dead.
Speaking of dead, you are brain-dead, AlwaysWrong. It is apparent from
your meaningless posts.
 
On Sun, 06 May 2012 13:45:35 -0700, Chieftain of the Carpet Crawlers
<theslipperman@thebarattheendoftheuniverse.org> wrote:

On Sun, 6 May 2012 17:28:48 +0100, "Ian Field"
gangprobing.alien@ntlworld.com> wrote:

I have 100 100s and >200 60s. That's stock for home use.

That's due to the fact that you are a carbon retard.
AlwaysWrong is even wrong with his quotes. Carbon retard? Coming from
AlwaysWrong, it's always wrong. It's not even possible.

Goddamned cross posting retards.

The $50 LED bulb will last 20 years.
WTF do I care? Who but a dim bulb would believe such marketing crap, DimBulb?
That alone would pay for it, but it also pays for itself in energy
savings.
Always Wrong.

You are dumber than dogshit.
AlwaysWrong, deep in scat.

There are even LED based spotlights out there that beat the
incandescents. ESPECIALLY on power. But also brightness.
What an idiot, you are, DimBulb.

Face it, hot filaments are all but dead.
A *long* way from it, AlwaysWrong.
 
On May 6, 1:45 pm, Chieftain of the Carpet Crawlers
<theslipper...@thebarattheendoftheuniverse.org> wrote:
On Sun, 6 May 2012 17:28:48 +0100, "Ian Field"

gangprobing.al...@ntlworld.com> wrote:
I have 100 100s and >200 60s. That's stock for home use.

 That's due to the fact that you are a carbon retard.

 Goddamned cross posting retards.

 The $50 LED bulb will last 20 years.

  That alone would pay for it, but it also pays for itself in energy
savings.

  You are dumber than dogshit.
Yes, but you forget that those $50 LED bulbs will be selling for $5 in
5 years and will be brighter. So, why would I want to waste $45 buying
it now?

-Bill


 There are even LED based spotlights out there that beat the
incandescents. ESPECIALLY on power. But also brightness.

 Face it, hot filaments are all but dead.
 
Arfa Daily wrote:
I had a similar problem on one of my cars a few years back. It would also
just randomly cut out, and refuse to restart, but for minutes rather than
days. I too thought that it was an ignition problem, and suspected the
electronic ignition module. However, I connected a whole bunch of LEDs to
various points in the system, and discovered that when it failed, it was the
feed to the electric fuel pump that was going off, and the problem
ultimately proved to be bad joints in the fuel pump relay, which had a PCB
inside, with its own driver transistor and a few other bits and bobs on it.

Just a few weeks ago, my current car started doing something similar. It
would just completely fail to start, even though the engine was warm and had
been running just fine only minutes before. But if you left it for a few
hours and then came back to it, it would start first flick of the key.
Again, I suspected either an ignition or ECU problem as when it was failing
to start, it put the engine management error light on, but it turned out to
be the fuel pump motor failing to start.

Lucas strikes again, and again! ;-)


--
You can't have a sense of humor, if you have no sense.
 
On May 2, 2:56 am, amdx <a...@knologynotthis.net> wrote:
On 5/1/2012 6:38 PM,BillSlomanwrote:

On May 1, 10:43 pm, amdx<a...@knologynotthis.net>  wrote:
On 4/30/2012 11:36 AM,BillSlomanwrote:

On Apr 30, 7:03 am, Robert Baer<robertb...@localnet.com>    wrote:
flipper wrote:
On Sun, 29 Apr 2012 14:34:28 -0700, Jim Thompson
To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-I...@On-My-Web-Site.com>      wrote:

On Sat, 28 Apr 2012 16:22:54 -0500, amdx<a...@knologynotthis.net>      wrote:

On 4/26/2012 2:28 PM, Joel Koltner wrote:
Jim Thompson wrote:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CZ-4gnNz0vc&feature=player_embedded

Well, hey... it's pretty well-produced; definitely gives Michael Moore
some "competition," I suppose.

    One video leads to another and I end up here.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=endscreen&NR=1&v=bavou_SEj1E

At 2:18 she says "somebody needs to pay for all my children...take care
of all our suffering... somebody needs to be held accountable."

                Mikek

The poor thang ;-)

What we need is a welfare rule where adding a kid _after_ you go on welfare
_reduces_ the take.

                                         ...Jim Thompson

The problem with notions of what is, in essence, a 'child tax' is it
punishes not only the 'excess' child but the others as well.

     THAT is _exactly_ the point...

Which is what makes it immoral and moronic. It isn't the child's fault
that it was born to a mother without a sound grasp of social
realities, and it doesn't make much sense to punish the child for its
mother's errors.

It's in society's interest to see that the child is well enough fed
and educated while it grows up to be able to become potentially useful
adult.

Punishing the mother provides instant gratification, but risks
damaging the child. Taking the children away and putting them into
care is a theoretical possibility. but in practice it's too expensive
to be used as a matter of routine, and even good care-givers aren't
all that much better for the child than a tolerably bad biological
mother.

     What ratio would you accept?
Can we damage one to prevent 20, 50, or 200 from be put into that
cesspool, which creates it's own damage.

None. Human sacrifice is no longer acceptable, no matter how you dress
it up.

And with adequate social security, a low income environment isn't a
cesspool. It's not a great environment, but lots of people survive it
and go to be  useful and productive citizens. Good environments still
produce their own quota of bad apples.

Look at Germany. You can have adequate social security and a blooming
economy,

    The people of Germany have a work ethic, we have generations
  that think it's ethical to live on welfare.
The Germans have had adequate social security rather longer than
you've had inadequate social security - if social security was going
to rot anybody's moral fibre, it would have rotted Germany's first.

We have entitlement
programs that we do pay into but, we receive more out than we pay in.
Neat trick.

  We now have 150 million of our citizens receiving money from the
government.
Interesting claim. Where's the evidence to support it?

<snip>

--
Bill Sloman, Nijmegen
 
On Mon, 07 May 2012 09:42:19 -0400, "Michael A. Terrell"
<mike.terrell@earthlink.net> wrote:

josephkk wrote:

p.s. Michael PM me.


I sent you an email.
I will respond within a few days.
 
On Sun, 06 May 2012 08:17:56 -0700, Fred Abse
<excretatauris@invalid.invalid> wrote:

On Sun, 06 May 2012 16:45:30 -0700, josephkk wrote:

I prefer to look in the mirror when
i wash my face.

I find that pointless. My eyes are full of soap ;-)
Then you have a problem with technique. Your eyelids should be covered
not your eyes.

?-)
 
On May 8, 9:19 pm, josephkk <joseph_barr...@sbcglobal.net> wrote:

NO! IT IS NOT THE 8TH, YOU RETARDED BASTARD!

S T O P Posting to this group until you SET your CLOCK and DATE
correctly,
you stupid, group abusing motherfucker!
 
spamtrap1888 wrote:
On May 2, 3:40 pm, Les Cargill<lcargil...@comcast.com> wrote:
Charlie E. wrote:
On Wed, 02 May 2012 12:33:32 -0500, Les Cargill
lcargil...@comcast.com> wrote:

Charlie E. wrote:
,snip
There used to be a stigma about being on relief. You didn't want
to do it, and if you did, you got off as quickly as you could.

But then, in the 60's and 70's, a new meme took hold, those that
purposely went on 'relief.' Welfare moms, entire households of
multiple generations living comfortably on the dole. And, the
sad truth was, it was ENCOURAGED by those in authority.

Whut? I have known very, very few people who *preferred* to be on
relief/welfare. I know a lot of people who have had some measure of
trouble finding a job - not because they aren't qualified, but
because jobs are disappearing.

You see, you define relief = welfare, when it encompasses a much
larger number of programs today. You should go to the grocery store
more often. It seems like about half the folks in the check out are
doing the 'food stamp shuffle' where they pick one from column A,
put all their 'not-allowed' products in group B, and spend an extra
five minutes paying for everything.

This is true. Scope is always iffy in these threads.

I thought the subject was "welfare moms, entire households... on
the dole" above. That sounds suspiciously like *welfare* welfare,
not a modest food subsidy to the working poor.

Once upon a time, there were "commdities". You went to the ... USDA?
office, signed up they gave you stuff like powdered milk, beans, cheese.

These were in essence oversupply bought by the USDA as part of farm
subsidies.

Some genius decided that rather than keep that whole infrastructure in
place, why we'd just have "generic" foodstuffs and allow people to
buy the stuff in stores. To replace the subsidy, food stamps were
invented. Maybe it saved money; I dunno. Ex ante, it looks like
it would be very price-distorting, and it is.

Food stamps have been around since the 1950s that I know of.
I couldn't quickly find exactly when it started.

Using the
normal food distribution system makes more sense than having the
government duplicate part of it. American farmers grow a lot of food
-- in the 60s and 70s practically everything in the supermarket was
American-grown and processed.

Although my inlaws did receive free generic Velveeta and nonfat dry
milk in the 1980s. They just went down to the senior center to pick it
up.
Right.

Other than the delay in line, I doubt the whole program really
costs *anything* in real terms. It's kind a' like WIC; it runs
the price of cheese and milk up.

If I read this right:http://www.fns.usda.gov/pd/SNAPsummary.htm

It's (rounding up) $78B. That's in the noise. I don't
see any positive feedback runaway here...

We *have* absorb the fact that work is a declining factor of production.
Because you have to absorb facts.


A combination of low wage workers and tax subsidies make products
relatively cheap.

The stuff that's gotten cheapest most quickly didn't have much
subsidy at all. Wages go low when a product or service doesn't
provide marginal product that keeps up with economic growth.

For *food* the subsidy regime seems to have kept
prices stable and low.

We did the math here - "welfare" welfare is not that significant a
load on the economy - under 5% of GDP (more like 2-3% ) .

Disability, SS and Medicare are a problem.

When people who don't have a lot of savings go out of the job
market, they go on disability. We can't shoot 'em...

People dependent on the government voted for more government.
Government that promised to 'take care' of people got reelected.
So, now we have a society in which half of the population doesn't
pay income taxes.

That isn't a problem in itself, except that it reflects the fact
that wages are flat as a still pond.

No, it is a problem. We have convinced over 50% of Americans that
they should get a 'free ride' from everyone else, or actually get
something more from everyone else. It is a pernicous attitude that
should be stopped!

I do not give a rat's patoot about *anybody's* "attitude". We do
progressive taxation in the US. This is a good thing, for cultural as
well as economic efficiency reasons.

The reason people are out of work is that more and more work
is done by machines.

s/machines/Asians/
First one, then the other.

It's not like we're short on goods and
services. If you're gonna enjoy the resulting low prices,
you gotta pony up to keep people alive who got "made redundant"
by that process.

Do you want a houseful of cheap crap, or a job that will support a
family?
That smacks of false alternative. And I'm pretty sure the answer will
be "both".

We *have* absorb the fact that work is a declining factor of production.
Because you have to absorb facts.


In the process we've lost our national treasure, the Yankee ingenuity
that made us the most productive manufacturers in the world.

We still are the most productive. Labor inputs into that production
are just declining.

--
Les Cargill
 
On May 2, 9:20 am, Charlie E. <edmond...@ieee.org> wrote:
On Tue, 1 May 2012 16:52:03 -0700 (PDT), Bill Sloman





eac...@gmail.com> wrote:
On May 1, 7:22 pm, "k...@att.bizzzzzzzzzzzz" <k...@att.bizzzzzzzzzzzz
wrote:
On Tue, 1 May 2012 05:46:33 -0700 (PDT), dagmargoodb...@yahoo.com wrote:
On Apr 29, 7:08 pm, flipper <flip...@fish.net> wrote:
On Sun, 29 Apr 2012 14:34:28 -0700, Jim Thompson

To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-I...@On-My-Web-Site.com> wrote:
On Sat, 28 Apr 2012 16:22:54 -0500, amdx <a...@knologynotthis.net> wrote:

On 4/26/2012 2:28 PM, Joel Koltner wrote:
Jim Thompson wrote:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CZ-4gnNz0vc&feature=player_embedded

Well, hey... it's pretty well-produced; definitely gives Michael Moore
some "competition," I suppose.

 One video leads to another and I end up here.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=endscreen&NR=1&v=bavou_SEj1E

At 2:18 she says "somebody needs to pay for all my children...take care
of all our suffering... somebody needs to be held accountable."

             Mikek

The poor thang ;-)

What we need is a welfare rule where adding a kid _after_ you go on welfare
_reduces_ the take.

                                      ...Jim Thompson

The problem with notions of what is, in essence, a 'child tax' is it
punishes not only the 'excess' child but the others as well.

Giving someone money, just less, is punishment?

But, if they just published a schedule showing a decreasing
incremental benefit, the extra kid-for-ransom production would drop.

Of course that'll never happen, since the formulas are always too
complicated for anyone to understand.  Measuring everyone's "need" is
complicated.

On welfare?  Lose any children.  It's child abuse to allow children to grow up
in a welfare home and become the next generation of dependents.

But most of them don't. And with slightly more generous social
security, even fewer of them end up dependent - not so many more as
end up dependent after having grown up with a silver spoon in their
mouths.

Right-wing nitwits find reality much too complicated to cope with so
they idealise the world into 100% good bits, replete with mom and
apple pie, and 100% bad bits where all fathers are absentees and every
mother is a crackhead.

It's nonsense, but it is the kind of nonsense that even krw can
understand.

There used to be a stigma about being on relief.  You didn't want to
do it, and if you did, you got off as quickly as you could.

But then, in the 60's and 70's, a new meme took hold, those that
purposely went on 'relief.' Welfare moms, entire households of
multiple generations living comfortably on the dole.  And, the sad
truth was, it was ENCOURAGED by those in authority.  People dependent
on the government voted for more government.  Government that promised
to 'take care' of people got reelected.  So, now we have a society in
which half of the population doesn't pay income taxes. More and more
people are encouraged to use government relief services in their
everyday lives, and those services are breaking down under the load.

And nutcases like Bill still don't understand that there is anything
wrong!  :cool:
These posts are quite discouraging. In March, when these same
arguments were rehashed, I tried to point out the true situation: that
welfare was unchanged from the 30s to the 60s; that all that LBJ did
was try to break the cycle of welfare recipients raising other welfare
recipients by creating such programs as early childhood enrichment and
practical job training for youth. Yet the posters here keep slipping
back to their contrafactual beliefs. What's worse, unlike fantasies of
Santa Claus and the Easter Bunny, this nonsense is disturbing, not
satisfying. What motivates this clinging to unreality?
 
On May 2, 10:16 am, Jim Thompson <To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-I...@On-My-
Web-Site.com> wrote:
On Wed, 02 May 2012 09:20:54 -0700, Charlie E. <edmond...@ieee.org> wrote:
On Tue, 1 May 2012 16:52:03 -0700 (PDT), Bill Sloman
eac...@gmail.com> wrote:

On May 1, 7:22 pm, "k...@att.bizzzzzzzzzzzz" <k...@att.bizzzzzzzzzzzz
wrote:
On Tue, 1 May 2012 05:46:33 -0700 (PDT), dagmargoodb...@yahoo.com wrote:
On Apr 29, 7:08 pm, flipper <flip...@fish.net> wrote:
On Sun, 29 Apr 2012 14:34:28 -0700, Jim Thompson

To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-I...@On-My-Web-Site.com> wrote:
On Sat, 28 Apr 2012 16:22:54 -0500, amdx <a...@knologynotthis.net> wrote:

On 4/26/2012 2:28 PM, Joel Koltner wrote:
Jim Thompson wrote:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CZ-4gnNz0vc&feature=player_embedded

Well, hey... it's pretty well-produced; definitely gives Michael Moore
some "competition," I suppose.

 One video leads to another and I end up here.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=endscreen&NR=1&v=bavou_SEj1E

At 2:18 she says "somebody needs to pay for all my children...take care
of all our suffering... somebody needs to be held accountable."

             Mikek

The poor thang ;-)

What we need is a welfare rule where adding a kid _after_ you go on welfare
_reduces_ the take.

                                      ...Jim Thompson

The problem with notions of what is, in essence, a 'child tax' is it
punishes not only the 'excess' child but the others as well.

Giving someone money, just less, is punishment?

But, if they just published a schedule showing a decreasing
incremental benefit, the extra kid-for-ransom production would drop.

Of course that'll never happen, since the formulas are always too
complicated for anyone to understand.  Measuring everyone's "need" is
complicated.

On welfare?  Lose any children.  It's child abuse to allow children to grow up
in a welfare home and become the next generation of dependents.

But most of them don't. And with slightly more generous social
security, even fewer of them end up dependent - not so many more as
end up dependent after having grown up with a silver spoon in their
mouths.

Right-wing nitwits find reality much too complicated to cope with so
they idealise the world into 100% good bits, replete with mom and
apple pie, and 100% bad bits where all fathers are absentees and every
mother is a crackhead.

It's nonsense, but it is the kind of nonsense that even krw can
understand.

There used to be a stigma about being on relief.  You didn't want to
do it, and if you did, you got off as quickly as you could.

But then, in the 60's and 70's, a new meme took hold, those that
purposely went on 'relief.' Welfare moms, entire households of
multiple generations living comfortably on the dole.  And, the sad
truth was, it was ENCOURAGED by those in authority.  People dependent
on the government voted for more government.  Government that promised
to 'take care' of people got reelected.  So, now we have a society in
which half of the population doesn't pay income taxes. More and more
people are encouraged to use government relief services in their
everyday lives, and those services are breaking down under the load.

And nutcases like Bill still don't understand that there is anything
wrong!  :cool:

Charlie

The neighborhood where I grew up was a nice area of single-family homes (even
with some interspersed farm land) built for soldiers returning from WWII.... my
parents bought a house there in 1947.
What's the useful life of a woodframe building? If you put it into
service as a rental unit, after how many years would the IRS consider
even a brick house to be fully depreciated? I believe it's 35 years.
Thus those houses should have been completely rebuilt in the mid-90s.

The neighborhood was a middle-class mix of whites _and_ blacks... the
wealthiest was a black family (with a turkey farm :)

Now it's a slum with many homes replaced by multi-story government housing
(tenements)... so run down
The government housing is run down? Perhaps they don't collect enough
in taxes to maintain it. If you mean the single family homes, tiny
crackerboxes hurriedly slapped together as part of a government
program for returning GIs -- thus a cost of maintaining our armed
forces -- are unlikely to survive 65 years of raising families.

and scary-looking that, when I was last in
Huntington (for my Father's funeral), I didn't feel safe leaving the car to
take photographs.

There are no Caucasians left there.
Ah, you're afraid of black people.

So much for government "assistance".
True that government cannot depigment those who frighten you.
 
On May 2, 10:50 am, Charlie E. <edmond...@ieee.org> wrote:
On Wed, 02 May 2012 12:33:32 -0500, Les Cargill



lcargil...@comcast.com> wrote:
Charlie E. wrote:
,snip
There used to be a stigma about being on relief.  You didn't want to
do it, and if you did, you got off as quickly as you could.

But then, in the 60's and 70's, a new meme took hold, those that
purposely went on 'relief.' Welfare moms, entire households of
multiple generations living comfortably on the dole.  And, the sad
truth was, it was ENCOURAGED by those in authority.

Whut?  I have known very, very few people who *preferred* to be on
relief/welfare. I know a lot of people who have had some measure
of trouble finding  a job - not because they aren't qualified, but
because jobs are disappearing.

You see, you define relief = welfare, when it encompasses a much
larger number of programs today.  You should go to the grocery store
more often.  It seems like about half the folks in the check out are
doing the 'food stamp shuffle' where they pick one from column A, put
all their 'not-allowed' products in group B, and spend an extra five
minutes paying for everything.
Charlie dimly perceives that many people can't make ends meet. The sad
fact is that once Bush's bubble economy burst, no real economic growth
replaced it. People who could get family-sustaining wages from
manufacturing jobs have no replacements other than retail. Further,
even high-paying jobs are being offshored or outsourced. It's a great
day to be a Chinaman, but I digress.

Food stamps benefit America's farmers. In the Great Depression,
commodity prices sank below the cost of production. Farmers piled
oranges to rot, and dumped milk into rivers. Now, the government
supplements what farmers get paid for their produce, while families
get to eat the farmers' production. This was thought to be win-win.

We did the math here - "welfare" welfare is not that significant a load
on the economy - under 5% of GDP (more like 2-3% ) .

Disability, SS and Medicare are a  problem.

When people who don't have a lot of savings go out of the job market,
they go on disability. We can't shoot 'em...

People dependent on the government voted for more government.
Government that promised to 'take care' of people got reelected.  So,
now we have a society in which half of the population doesn't pay
income taxes.

That isn't a problem in itself, except that it reflects the fact that
wages are flat as a still pond.

No, it is a problem.  We have convinced over 50% of Americans that
they should get a 'free ride' from everyone else, or actually get
something more from everyone else.  It is a pernicous attitude that
should be stopped!
As I pointed out before, few people made more than the zero bracket
amount during the Depression. Families are no better off than they
were during the Depression. Pay people more, and they will pay more in
taxes.

If only there were organizations for workers to join, to raise their
pay to the point that they could pay more in federal income tax....


More and more people are encouraged to use government relief services
in their everyday lives, and those services are breaking down under
the load.

And nutcases like Bill still don't understand that there is anything
wrong!  :cool:
Something's terribly wrong when the US economy cannot produce jobs
that will sustain families, for everyone who wants one.
 
On May 2, 2:39 pm, amdx <a...@knology.net> wrote:
On 5/2/2012 11:20 AM, Charlie E. wrote:





On Tue, 1 May 2012 16:52:03 -0700 (PDT), Bill Sloman
eac...@gmail.com>  wrote:

On May 1, 7:22 pm, "k...@att.bizzzzzzzzzzzz"<k...@att.bizzzzzzzzzzzz
wrote:
On Tue, 1 May 2012 05:46:33 -0700 (PDT), dagmargoodb...@yahoo.com wrote:
On Apr 29, 7:08 pm, flipper<flip...@fish.net>  wrote:
On Sun, 29 Apr 2012 14:34:28 -0700, Jim Thompson

To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-I...@On-My-Web-Site.com>  wrote:
On Sat, 28 Apr 2012 16:22:54 -0500, amdx<a...@knologynotthis.net>  wrote:

On 4/26/2012 2:28 PM, Joel Koltner wrote:
Jim Thompson wrote:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CZ-4gnNz0vc&feature=player_embedded

Well, hey... it's pretty well-produced; definitely gives Michael Moore
some "competition," I suppose.

  One video leads to another and I end up here.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=endscreen&NR=1&v=bavou_SEj1E

At 2:18 she says "somebody needs to pay for all my children...take care
of all our suffering... somebody needs to be held accountable."

              Mikek

The poor thang ;-)

What we need is a welfare rule where adding a kid _after_ you go on welfare
_reduces_ the take.

                                       ...Jim Thompson

The problem with notions of what is, in essence, a 'child tax' is it
punishes not only the 'excess' child but the others as well.

Giving someone money, just less, is punishment?

But, if they just published a schedule showing a decreasing
incremental benefit, the extra kid-for-ransom production would drop.

Of course that'll never happen, since the formulas are always too
complicated for anyone to understand.  Measuring everyone's "need" is
complicated.

On welfare?  Lose any children.  It's child abuse to allow children to grow up
in a welfare home and become the next generation of dependents.

But most of them don't. And with slightly more generous social
security, even fewer of them end up dependent - not so many more as
end up dependent after having grown up with a silver spoon in their
mouths.

Right-wing nitwits find reality much too complicated to cope with so
they idealise the world into 100% good bits, replete with mom and
apple pie, and 100% bad bits where all fathers are absentees and every
mother is a crackhead.

It's nonsense, but it is the kind of nonsense that even krw can
understand.

There used to be a stigma about being on relief.  You didn't want to
do it, and if you did, you got off as quickly as you could.

But then, in the 60's and 70's, a new meme took hold, those that
purposely went on 'relief.' Welfare moms, entire households of
multiple generations living comfortably on the dole.  And, the sad
truth was, it was ENCOURAGED by those in authority.  People dependent
on the government voted for more government.  Government that promised
to 'take care' of people got reelected.  So, now we have a society in
which half of the population doesn't pay income taxes. More and more
people are encouraged to use government relief services in their
everyday lives, and those services are breaking down under the load.

And nutcases like Bill still don't understand that there is anything
wrong!  :cool:

Charlie

   Yes, there is no longer shame!
Here in Florida they have changed food stamps to EBT.
Electronic Funds Transfer
  My business is selling shrimp, I have people ask "do you take EBT?"
I don't, but when I'm ask, I have this bubble over my head that says,
"if the taxpayers are buying the protein you need for survival, you
should buy $2.00 lb chicken rather than $10 lb shrimp."
  But that's the mentality, it's not their money so they don't care.
                  Mikek-
Shrimp is a cheap food these days, cheaper than vertebrate fish.
 
On May 2, 3:40 pm, Les Cargill <lcargil...@comcast.com> wrote:
Charlie E. wrote:
On Wed, 02 May 2012 12:33:32 -0500, Les Cargill
lcargil...@comcast.com>  wrote:

Charlie E. wrote:
,snip
There used to be a stigma about being on relief.  You didn't want
to do it, and if you did, you got off as quickly as you could.

But then, in the 60's and 70's, a new meme took hold, those that
purposely went on 'relief.' Welfare moms, entire households of
multiple generations living comfortably on the dole.  And, the
sad truth was, it was ENCOURAGED by those in authority.

Whut?  I have known very, very few people who *preferred* to be on
relief/welfare. I know a lot of people who have had some measure of
trouble finding  a job - not because they aren't qualified, but
because jobs are disappearing.

You see, you define relief = welfare, when it encompasses a much
larger number of programs today.  You should go to the grocery store
more often.  It seems like about half the folks in the check out are
doing the 'food stamp shuffle' where they pick one from column A,
put all their 'not-allowed' products in group B, and spend an extra
five minutes paying for everything.

This is true. Scope is always iffy in these threads.

I thought the subject was "welfare moms, entire households... on
the dole" above. That sounds suspiciously like *welfare* welfare,
not a modest food subsidy to the working poor.

Once upon a time, there were "commdities". You went to the ... USDA?
office, signed up they gave you stuff like powdered milk, beans, cheese.

These were in essence oversupply bought by the USDA as part of farm
subsidies.

Some genius decided that rather than keep that whole infrastructure in
place, why we'd just have "generic" foodstuffs and  allow people to
buy the stuff in stores. To replace the subsidy, food stamps were
invented. Maybe it saved money; I dunno. Ex ante, it looks like
it would be very price-distorting, and it is.
Food stamps have been around since the 1950s that I know of. Using the
normal food distribution system makes more sense than having the
government duplicate part of it. American farmers grow a lot of food
-- in the 60s and 70s practically everything in the supermarket was
American-grown and processed.

Although my inlaws did receive free generic Velveeta and nonfat dry
milk in the 1980s. They just went down to the senior center to pick it
up.

Other than the delay in line, I doubt the whole program really
costs *anything* in real terms. It's kind a' like WIC; it runs
the price of cheese and milk up.

If I read this right:http://www.fns.usda.gov/pd/SNAPsummary.htm

It's (rounding up) $78B. That's in the noise. I don't
see any positive feedback runaway here...

We *have* absorb the fact that work is a declining factor of production.
Because you have to absorb facts.
A combination of low wage workers and tax subsidies make products
relatively cheap.

We did the math here - "welfare" welfare is not that significant a
load on the economy - under 5% of GDP (more like 2-3% ) .

Disability, SS and Medicare are a  problem.

When people who don't have a lot of savings go out of the job
market, they go on disability. We can't shoot 'em...

People dependent on the government voted for more government.
Government that promised to 'take care' of people got reelected.
So, now we have a society in which half of the population doesn't
pay income taxes.

That isn't a problem in itself, except that it reflects the fact
that wages are flat as a still pond.

No, it is a problem.  We have convinced over 50% of Americans that
they should get a 'free ride' from everyone else, or actually get
something more from everyone else.  It is a pernicous attitude that
should be stopped!

I do not give a rat's patoot about *anybody's* "attitude". We do
progressive taxation in the US. This is a good thing, for cultural as
well as economic efficiency reasons.

The reason people are out of work is that more and more work
is done by machines.
s/machines/Asians/

It's not like we're short on goods and
services. If you're gonna enjoy the resulting low prices,
you gotta pony up to keep people alive who got "made redundant"
by that process.
Do you want a houseful of cheap crap, or a job that will support a
family?

We *have* absorb the fact that work is a declining factor of production.
Because you have to absorb facts.
In the process we've lost our national treasure, the Yankee ingenuity
that made us the most productive manufacturers in the world.
 

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