The Biden Administration is winging it about electrification...

[Fred Bloggs]

On Saturday, July 30, 2022 at 12:01:06 PM UTC-4, Ricky wrote:

On Saturday, July 30, 2022 at 11:48:32 AM UTC-4, Ralph Mowery wrote:
In article <a7c42310-3b41-45f9...@googlegroups.com>,
gnuarm.del...@gmail.com says...

When all cars are BEVs, it will result in a 20% increase in total electrical generation from today\'s levels.

More than 95% of BEV charging is done at night, during the slack time of electrical demand. This 95+% will not require any additional generation or transmission capability. The remaining <5% of 20% or <1% of charging will be at peak time. So the existing grid will need to grow by 1% to accommodate charging that will happen at
peak time.

I think we can manage that.



While the cars are recharged at night, where are all the solar
generators going to get the sun light to power them ?

Does the wind blow at night like it does in the daytime ? That I do not
know.
Lol.

If you want to use solar power to charge your car, then charge it during the day when the duck curve is low. No one is stopping you.

Care to explain what throttling back the nuclear generator output has to do with anything?

You *do* have a BEV, right?

--

Rick C.

+- Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
+- Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209

 

[Ed Lee]

On Saturday, July 30, 2022 at 9:05:47 AM UTC-7, Ed Lee wrote:

On Saturday, July 30, 2022 at 9:02:11 AM UTC-7, Ricky wrote:
On Saturday, July 30, 2022 at 11:29:30 AM UTC-4, Ed Lee wrote:
On Saturday, July 30, 2022 at 8:23:17 AM UTC-7, upsid...@downunder.com wrote:
On Fri, 29 Jul 2022 22:38:13 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
soar2...@yahoo.com> wrote:

They have NO CLUE what will be required of the electrical grid to support the quantity of EVs envisioned by these idiots. How much increase in grid capacity do YOU think will be required? Post your answers below.
For your own calculations to get a ballpark value:

How much do you drive with your car every year ?

Divide that by 365 to get how much you drive each day on average.
Divide that by 24 to get how far you drive each hour on average.

If you have an EV, check out how far you can drive with 1 kWh.

Divide the average hour distance with how far you get with 1 kWh. This
will give the average charging power which is on for 24 hours each day
for every days of the year. In most cases, the average charging power
is well below 0.5 kW (500 W). This is the additional power drawn by
your house.

Compare those figures if an extra heater/cooler is added to your
house. Does the network crash by that addition ?
Good idea.

I drove around 5000 miles, or 1300 kwhr per year. Around 70 days of a 1kw room heater. May be couple of weeks of whole house heating or cooling.
Does that include the energy used in all the tows?
Yes. I had around 50 miles (including round trip tow trucks) of towing. So, less than one day of room heating.

My next challenge is to bring the 30 miles (10kwhr) Leaf to Vegas, probably with generator. Lowest i have seen is 8kwhr, on the way to 5. We can restore the main #1 battery to 24 with new pouch cells, but lots of work for 96 modules. It\'s much easier to add #2,#3 and #4.

 

[Ralph Mowery]

In article <669814fe-8865-4857-a8a8-04ff8eef3e8bn@googlegroups.com>,
gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com says...

If you want to use solar power to charge your car, then charge it during the day when the duck curve is low. No one is stopping you.

You *do* have a BEV, right?

You just said charge at night when the demand is low, now you want to
charge during the day when the demand is low. What is it demand low at
night or day in your opinion ?


I doubt I would ever have a BEV. Not paying thousands more for a car
over a gas one .
At my age (72) I may have already bought my last car, a 2017 and 2007
truck with only 75,000 miles on it. The wife has a 2020 car with less
than 5000 miles on it. For me, time is too short to worry about when and
where to plug in and wait while there are plenty of gas stations.

 

[rbowman]

On 07/30/2022 09:48 AM, Ralph Mowery wrote:

In article <a7c42310-3b41-45f9-a4ec-f3dc6a51d0dan@googlegroups.com>,
gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com says...

When all cars are BEVs, it will result in a 20% increase in total electrical generation from today\'s levels.

More than 95% of BEV charging is done at night, during the slack time of electrical demand. This 95+% will not require any additional generation or transmission capability. The remaining <5% of 20% or <1% of charging will be at peak time. So the existing grid will need to grow by 1% to accommodate charging that will happen at
peak time.

I think we can manage that.




While the cars are recharged at night, where are all the solar
generators going to get the sun light to power them ?

Does the wind blow at night like it does in the daytime ? That I do not
know.

In general, no. Excluding weather fronts thermal heating is responsible
for a lot of air motion. This is particularly noticeable in the desert.
The wind picks up when the sun rises and usually calms down after
sunset. If you don\'t like sand in your hamburgers grill after dark.

 

[rbowman]

On 07/30/2022 09:56 AM, Ed Lee wrote:

On Saturday, July 30, 2022 at 8:48:32 AM UTC-7, Ralph Mowery wrote:
In article <a7c42310-3b41-45f9...@googlegroups.com>,
gnuarm.del...@gmail.com says...

When all cars are BEVs, it will result in a 20% increase in total electrical generation from today\'s levels.

More than 95% of BEV charging is done at night, during the slack time of electrical demand. This 95+% will not require any additional generation or transmission capability. The remaining <5% of 20% or <1% of charging will be at peak time. So the existing grid will need to grow by 1% to accommodate charging that will happen at
peak time.

I think we can manage that.



While the cars are recharged at night, where are all the solar
generators going to get the sun light to power them ?

Does the wind blow at night like it does in the daytime ? That I do not
know.

Yes it does. Wind blows 24/7.

Never lived in the desert, did you?

 

[Rich S]

On Saturday, July 30, 2022 at 5:38:16 AM UTC, Flyguy wrote:

They have NO CLUE what will be required of the electrical grid to support the quantity of EVs envisioned by these idiots. How much increase in grid capacity do YOU think will be required? Post your answers below.

Speaking for US only, the \"Residential\", and \"Commercial/Public Services\" are the roughly at top
consumers of electricity (each 36-38% of total energy consumed per year). If we\'ve talking about
electric vehicles, both of those sectors are relevant.

In the Residential sector, for many homes, typically, the appliance with highest electricity use is
the refrigerator. (typical ~ exclude extra heating).

And so the move has been for many years, getting people to replace the old inefficient
models with modern more efficient ones. Refrigerators & such, via Energy Star program
have advertised the benefit at retail, when most people make their shopping choices.

Getting individuals to be aware of how their individual choices impact the collective society, is (ahem)
quite difficult & touchy, I think we\'d all agree......

 

[Ralph Mowery]

In article <jklenhFa1n6U1@mid.individual.net>, bowman@montana.com
says...

In general, no. Excluding weather fronts thermal heating is responsible
for a lot of air motion. This is particularly noticeable in the desert.
The wind picks up when the sun rises and usually calms down after
sunset. If you don\'t like sand in your hamburgers grill after dark.

I thought something like that but did not know for sure. My thinking
was that not too long after sunset there was no heat to make much wind
where the wind generators would be at.

 

[Ed Lee]

On Saturday, July 30, 2022 at 12:39:19 PM UTC-7, Ralph Mowery wrote:

In article <jklenh...@mid.individual.net>, bow...@montana.com
says...

In general, no. Excluding weather fronts thermal heating is responsible
for a lot of air motion. This is particularly noticeable in the desert.
The wind picks up when the sun rises and usually calms down after
sunset. If you don\'t like sand in your hamburgers grill after dark.




I thought something like that but did not know for sure. My thinking
was that not too long after sunset there was no heat to make much wind
where the wind generators would be at.

Perhaps to a lesser degree. But there is wind as long as the Earth is turning. We have rather windy nights near the ocean as well.

 

[server]

On Sat, 30 Jul 2022 12:37:20 -0700 (PDT), Rich S
<richsulinengineer@gmail.com> wrote:

On Saturday, July 30, 2022 at 5:38:16 AM UTC, Flyguy wrote:
They have NO CLUE what will be required of the electrical grid to support the quantity of EVs envisioned by these idiots. How much increase in grid capacity do YOU think will be required? Post your answers below.


Speaking for US only, the \"Residential\", and \"Commercial/Public Services\" are the roughly at top
consumers of electricity (each 36-38% of total energy consumed per year). If we\'ve talking about
electric vehicles, both of those sectors are relevant.

In the Residential sector, for many homes, typically, the appliance with highest electricity use is
the refrigerator. (typical ~ exclude extra heating).

And so the move has been for many years, getting people to replace the old inefficient
models with modern more efficient ones. Refrigerators & such, via Energy Star program
have advertised the benefit at retail, when most people make their shopping choices.

Getting individuals to be aware of how their individual choices impact the collective society, is (ahem)
quite difficult & touchy, I think we\'d all agree......

There is a war on natural gas in several places in California. No gas
hookups allowed on new construction. They want houses to be all
electric.

That could get interesting. And expensive.

 

[server]

On Sat, 30 Jul 2022 08:33:39 -0700 (PDT), Ricky
<gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> wrote:

On Saturday, July 30, 2022 at 1:38:16 AM UTC-4, Flyguy wrote:
They have NO CLUE what will be required of the electrical grid to support the quantity of EVs envisioned by these idiots. How much increase in grid capacity do YOU think will be required? Post your answers below.

When all cars are BEVs, it will result in a 20% increase in total electrical generation from today\'s levels.

More than 95% of BEV charging is done at night, during the slack time of electrical demand. This 95+% will not require any additional generation or transmission capability. The remaining <5% of 20% or <1% of charging will be at peak time. So the existing grid will need to grow by 1% to accommodate charging that will happen at peak time.

Depends on the electric production mix in a particular country.

If you have plenty of nuclear power, charging by night (and weekends)
makes perfectly sense.

However, if you have to use expensive peak power gas turbines during
the day, extending the high demand to the night would force to use
these expensive turbines into the night.

With plenty of solar power, charging during the day is also viable.

If you live in a sunny area and only drive short distances daily, you
could even live without external charging
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lightyear_One
That car has 5 m^2 solar panels of its own, so it would charge
batteries with a few hundred watts while driving on a sunny road or
when parked in a sunny car park.

 

[server]

On Sat, 30 Jul 2022 23:36:43 +0300, upsidedown@downunder.com wrote:

On Sat, 30 Jul 2022 08:33:39 -0700 (PDT), Ricky
gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> wrote:

On Saturday, July 30, 2022 at 1:38:16 AM UTC-4, Flyguy wrote:
They have NO CLUE what will be required of the electrical grid to support the quantity of EVs envisioned by these idiots. How much increase in grid capacity do YOU think will be required? Post your answers below.

When all cars are BEVs, it will result in a 20% increase in total electrical generation from today\'s levels.

More than 95% of BEV charging is done at night, during the slack time of electrical demand. This 95+% will not require any additional generation or transmission capability. The remaining <5% of 20% or <1% of charging will be at peak time. So the existing grid will need to grow by 1% to accommodate charging that will happen at peak time.

Depends on the electric production mix in a particular country.

If you have plenty of nuclear power, charging by night (and weekends)
makes perfectly sense.

However, if you have to use expensive peak power gas turbines during
the day, extending the high demand to the night would force to use
these expensive turbines into the night.

With plenty of solar power, charging during the day is also viable.

If you live in a sunny area and only drive short distances daily, you
could even live without external charging
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lightyear_One
That car has 5 m^2 solar panels of its own, so it would charge
batteries with a few hundred watts while driving on a sunny road or
when parked in a sunny car park.

Really funny. If the solar panels add 40 miles per day of range, it
would run about 5 MPH on solar power. In the summer. For $170,000.

 

[Ed Lee]

On Saturday, July 30, 2022 at 1:58:57 PM UTC-7, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:

On Sat, 30 Jul 2022 23:36:43 +0300, upsid...@downunder.com wrote:

On Sat, 30 Jul 2022 08:33:39 -0700 (PDT), Ricky
gnuarm.del...@gmail.com> wrote:

On Saturday, July 30, 2022 at 1:38:16 AM UTC-4, Flyguy wrote:
They have NO CLUE what will be required of the electrical grid to support the quantity of EVs envisioned by these idiots. How much increase in grid capacity do YOU think will be required? Post your answers below.

When all cars are BEVs, it will result in a 20% increase in total electrical generation from today\'s levels.

More than 95% of BEV charging is done at night, during the slack time of electrical demand. This 95+% will not require any additional generation or transmission capability. The remaining <5% of 20% or <1% of charging will be at peak time. So the existing grid will need to grow by 1% to accommodate charging that will happen at peak time.

Depends on the electric production mix in a particular country.

If you have plenty of nuclear power, charging by night (and weekends)
makes perfectly sense.

However, if you have to use expensive peak power gas turbines during
the day, extending the high demand to the night would force to use
these expensive turbines into the night.

With plenty of solar power, charging during the day is also viable.

If you live in a sunny area and only drive short distances daily, you
could even live without external charging
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lightyear_One
That car has 5 m^2 solar panels of its own, so it would charge
batteries with a few hundred watts while driving on a sunny road or
when parked in a sunny car park.
Really funny. If the solar panels add 40 miles per day of range, it
would run about 5 MPH on solar power. In the summer. For $170,000.

The panel itself is only couple hundreds. I think i can put around 2 m^2 on my Leaf, for around $500 at 300W. It will add around 10 miles per day. Actually, i have to worry about overcharging, if I don\'t drive it for 4 or 5 days.

I have around 10kW solar panels in storage.

 

[Ed Lee]

On Saturday, July 30, 2022 at 2:09:59 PM UTC-7, Ed Lee wrote:

On Saturday, July 30, 2022 at 1:58:57 PM UTC-7, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
On Sat, 30 Jul 2022 23:36:43 +0300, upsid...@downunder.com wrote:

On Sat, 30 Jul 2022 08:33:39 -0700 (PDT), Ricky
gnuarm.del...@gmail.com> wrote:

On Saturday, July 30, 2022 at 1:38:16 AM UTC-4, Flyguy wrote:
They have NO CLUE what will be required of the electrical grid to support the quantity of EVs envisioned by these idiots. How much increase in grid capacity do YOU think will be required? Post your answers below.

When all cars are BEVs, it will result in a 20% increase in total electrical generation from today\'s levels.

More than 95% of BEV charging is done at night, during the slack time of electrical demand. This 95+% will not require any additional generation or transmission capability. The remaining <5% of 20% or <1% of charging will be at peak time. So the existing grid will need to grow by 1% to accommodate charging that will happen at peak time.

Depends on the electric production mix in a particular country.

If you have plenty of nuclear power, charging by night (and weekends)
makes perfectly sense.

However, if you have to use expensive peak power gas turbines during
the day, extending the high demand to the night would force to use
these expensive turbines into the night.

With plenty of solar power, charging during the day is also viable.

If you live in a sunny area and only drive short distances daily, you
could even live without external charging
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lightyear_One
That car has 5 m^2 solar panels of its own, so it would charge
batteries with a few hundred watts while driving on a sunny road or
when parked in a sunny car park.
Really funny. If the solar panels add 40 miles per day of range, it
would run about 5 MPH on solar power. In the summer. For $170,000.
The panel itself is only couple hundreds. I think i can put around 2 m^2 on my Leaf, for around $500 at 300W. It will add around 10 miles per day. Actually, i have to worry about overcharging, if I don\'t drive it for 4 or 5 days.

I have around 10kW solar panels in storage.

By the way, you can get 30% solar ITC with 10% to 20% add-on with battery. So, your Uncle Sam will pay half of the cost.

 

[Flyguy]

On Saturday, July 30, 2022 at 12:51:23 AM UTC-7, bill....@ieee.org wrote:

On Saturday, July 30, 2022 at 3:38:16 PM UTC+10, Flyguy wrote:
They have NO CLUE what will be required of the electrical grid to support the quantity of EVs envisioned by these idiots. How much increase in grid capacity do YOU think will be required? Post your answers below.
Why bother? The answer is well known, and was posted here years ago - about 30%. An instant google search throws up this

https://www.forbes.com/sites/jamesmorris/2021/11/13/electricity-grids-can-handle-electric-vehicles-easily--they-just-need-proper-management/?sh=e6e6bc578629

Forbes has more recent estimates and it is a bit lower for the US and appreciably lower for the UK.

So Flyguy is the same ignorant idiot that he has always been. He seems to feel this compulsion to advertise his rapidly advancing dementia, and waste bandwidth in the process. He doesn\'t need to bother. We\'ve known that he is hopeless twit for quite a while now.

--
Bill Sloman, Sydney

SNIPPERMAN\'s mind seems to be clouded by his own dementia, almost as much as Lyin\' Biden\'s.

The point is that the electrical grid is strained to the max right now, with absolutely NO initiative by Lyin\' Biden\'s administration to fix it. If anything, they are pulling fossil-fueled facilities offline. We are being warned - around the world - of this problem:
https://www.nerc.com/news/Headlines%20DL/May%2018%202022%20SRA%20Announcement.pdf
https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/2022/06/02/blackout-states-summer-heat/
Even SNIPPERMAN\'s beloved OZ is not immune:
https://www.reuters.com/markets/commodities/australia-power-market-halted-dramatic-move-avert-blackouts-2022-06-15/

The average home uses 11,000 kwh. If it added two EVs driven a total of 15,000 miles that would add another 5,200 kwh, for a total of 16,200 kwh. As there are 140 million homes in the US, that would add 730 BILLION kwh to the grid. As total demand is about 3.9 trillion kwh, this represents a 19% increase in unplanned for demand.

Given that we are at the breaking point now, and that there are no new generating facilities planned for other than undispatchable renewables, and aging plants are being shut down, we are headed for a crisis. Actually, we are ALREADY in a crisis.

Note: instantaneous charging capacity is a red herring, and the province of fools.

 

[Flyguy]

On Saturday, July 30, 2022 at 5:55:41 AM UTC-7, Fred Bloggs wrote:

On Saturday, July 30, 2022 at 1:38:16 AM UTC-4, Flyguy wrote:
They have NO CLUE what will be required of the electrical grid to support the quantity of EVs envisioned by these idiots. How much increase in grid capacity do YOU think will be required? Post your answers below.
They have no clue? Really? Do you really think the U.S. government and industry are basically doing nothing that isn\'t publicized in the media for mentally defectives that you watch?

DoE (Dept Energy for you) is on it. They formed and coordinated a Grid Integration Tech Team (GITT) and Integrated Systems Analysis Tech Team (ISATT) to tap into the best and most relevant knowledge about the subject. As you might expect, the teams have representatives of the electrical power generation industry as they just might have a smidge to do with the actual implementation, don\'t you think? Looks like the following participated:
American Electric Power,
Argonne National Laboratory, BP America, Chevron Corporation, DTE Energy, Duke Energy,
the Electric Power Research Institute, ExxonMobil Corporation, FCA US LLC, Ford Motor
Company, General Motors, the National Renewable Energy Laboratory, Oak Ridge National
Laboratory, Idaho National Laboratory, Pacific Northwest National Laboratory, Phillips 66
Company, Shell Oil Products U.S., Southern California Edison Company, U.S.. Council for
Automotive Research LLC, the U.S. Department of Energy.
And each of these participants further tap into fairly vast resources specific to their area of expertise.

You can read a summary of their work here:
https://www.energy.gov/sites/prod/files/2019/12/f69/GITT%20ISATT%20EVs%20at%20Scale%20Grid%20Summary%20Report%20FINAL%20Nov2019.pdf

We\'ll eagerly await your usual highly detailed and fact based analysis of their work. I\'m sure it contains manifold laws you will relish exposing.

What that summary fails to say ANYTHING about are brownouts and blackouts (I searched for it), which is the crisis facing us RIGHT NOW! Adding more electrical loads are just going to make this crisis worse. This report is just another example where they decided on the conclusion and wrote a piece of shit to back it up.

 

[Flyguy]

On Saturday, July 30, 2022 at 8:23:17 AM UTC-7, upsid...@downunder.com wrote:

On Fri, 29 Jul 2022 22:38:13 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
soar2...@yahoo.com> wrote:

They have NO CLUE what will be required of the electrical grid to support the quantity of EVs envisioned by these idiots. How much increase in grid capacity do YOU think will be required? Post your answers below.
For your own calculations to get a ballpark value:

How much do you drive with your car every year ?

Divide that by 365 to get how much you drive each day on average.
Divide that by 24 to get how far you drive each hour on average.

If you have an EV, check out how far you can drive with 1 kWh.

Divide the average hour distance with how far you get with 1 kWh. This
will give the average charging power which is on for 24 hours each day
for every days of the year. In most cases, the average charging power
is well below 0.5 kW (500 W). This is the additional power drawn by
your house.

Compare those figures if an extra heater/cooler is added to your
house. Does the network crash by that addition ?

You make things FAR TOO COMPLICATED! The average EV uses 0.346 kwh/mi. The average home drives 15,000 miles per year, for 5190 kwh. The average home, less EVs, consumes 11000 kwh, so switching to EVs will increase the average home\'s energy consumption by 47% (this may be low because it doesn\'t account for conversion inefficiencies, so it could be above 50%). So, FORGET about where they use their electricity - that just muddles the analysis.

 

[Ed Lee]

On Saturday, July 30, 2022 at 6:25:53 PM UTC-7, Flyguy wrote:

On Saturday, July 30, 2022 at 8:23:17 AM UTC-7, upsid...@downunder.com wrote:
On Fri, 29 Jul 2022 22:38:13 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
soar2...@yahoo.com> wrote:

They have NO CLUE what will be required of the electrical grid to support the quantity of EVs envisioned by these idiots. How much increase in grid capacity do YOU think will be required? Post your answers below.
For your own calculations to get a ballpark value:

How much do you drive with your car every year ?

Divide that by 365 to get how much you drive each day on average.
Divide that by 24 to get how far you drive each hour on average.

If you have an EV, check out how far you can drive with 1 kWh.

Divide the average hour distance with how far you get with 1 kWh. This
will give the average charging power which is on for 24 hours each day
for every days of the year. In most cases, the average charging power
is well below 0.5 kW (500 W). This is the additional power drawn by
your house.

Compare those figures if an extra heater/cooler is added to your
house. Does the network crash by that addition ?
You make things FAR TOO COMPLICATED! The average EV uses 0.346 kwh/mi. The average home drives 15,000 miles per year, for 5190 kwh. The average home, less EVs, consumes 11000 kwh, so switching to EVs will increase the average home\'s energy consumption by 47% (this may be low because it doesn\'t account for conversion inefficiencies, so it could be above 50%). So, FORGET about where they use their electricity - that just muddles the analysis.

15,000 miles may be on the high side. I personally drove around 5,000 per year.

11000 kwh per yr -> 30 kwh per day -> 1200w per hour -> 10A average. Most house have 200A panel. Using only 5% seems too low.

 

[Flyguy]

On Saturday, July 30, 2022 at 6:46:06 PM UTC-7, Ed Lee wrote:

On Saturday, July 30, 2022 at 6:25:53 PM UTC-7, Flyguy wrote:
On Saturday, July 30, 2022 at 8:23:17 AM UTC-7, upsid...@downunder.com wrote:
On Fri, 29 Jul 2022 22:38:13 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
soar2...@yahoo.com> wrote:

They have NO CLUE what will be required of the electrical grid to support the quantity of EVs envisioned by these idiots. How much increase in grid capacity do YOU think will be required? Post your answers below.
For your own calculations to get a ballpark value:

How much do you drive with your car every year ?

Divide that by 365 to get how much you drive each day on average.
Divide that by 24 to get how far you drive each hour on average.

If you have an EV, check out how far you can drive with 1 kWh.

Divide the average hour distance with how far you get with 1 kWh. This
will give the average charging power which is on for 24 hours each day
for every days of the year. In most cases, the average charging power
is well below 0.5 kW (500 W). This is the additional power drawn by
your house.

Compare those figures if an extra heater/cooler is added to your
house. Does the network crash by that addition ?
You make things FAR TOO COMPLICATED! The average EV uses 0.346 kwh/mi. The average home drives 15,000 miles per year, for 5190 kwh. The average home, less EVs, consumes 11000 kwh, so switching to EVs will increase the average home\'s energy consumption by 47% (this may be low because it doesn\'t account for conversion inefficiencies, so it could be above 50%). So, FORGET about where they use their electricity - that just muddles the analysis.
15,000 miles may be on the high side. I personally drove around 5,000 per year.

11000 kwh per yr -> 30 kwh per day -> 1200w per hour -> 10A average. Most house have 200A panel. Using only 5% seems too low.

That data maybe low - if you search for \"average household car mileage\" you get miles driven per DRIVER, not household. Men drive more miles than women, so if you add the two together 15,000 is a reasonable, and certainly not high, number per household. Of course, some will drive more and some less. In any case, it gives an approximate number for doing the whole USA calculation.

 

[Ricky]

On Saturday, July 30, 2022 at 12:32:43 PM UTC-4, Fred Bloggs wrote:

On Saturday, July 30, 2022 at 12:01:06 PM UTC-4, Ricky wrote:
On Saturday, July 30, 2022 at 11:48:32 AM UTC-4, Ralph Mowery wrote:
In article <a7c42310-3b41-45f9...@googlegroups.com>,
gnuarm.del...@gmail.com says...

When all cars are BEVs, it will result in a 20% increase in total electrical generation from today\'s levels.

More than 95% of BEV charging is done at night, during the slack time of electrical demand. This 95+% will not require any additional generation or transmission capability. The remaining <5% of 20% or <1% of charging will be at peak time. So the existing grid will need to grow by 1% to accommodate charging that will happen at
peak time.

I think we can manage that.



While the cars are recharged at night, where are all the solar
generators going to get the sun light to power them ?

Does the wind blow at night like it does in the daytime ? That I do not
know.
Lol.

If you want to use solar power to charge your car, then charge it during the day when the duck curve is low. No one is stopping you.
Care to explain what throttling back the nuclear generator output has to do with anything?

Perhaps you can explain the context? I don\'t see where anyone has mentioned the nuclear reactors, at least in this subthread.

--

Rick C.

--- Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
--- Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209

 

[Ricky]

On Saturday, July 30, 2022 at 2:47:30 PM UTC-4, Ralph Mowery wrote:

In article <669814fe-8865-4857...@googlegroups.com>,
gnuarm.del...@gmail.com says...

If you want to use solar power to charge your car, then charge it during the day when the duck curve is low. No one is stopping you.

You *do* have a BEV, right?


You just said charge at night when the demand is low, now you want to
charge during the day when the demand is low. What is it demand low at
night or day in your opinion ?

Perhaps you are not familiar with the fact that the electric demand curve has a peak around 6-8 pm. During the night, demand is much lower. During the day, demand is generally lower, but can be a lot lower, depending on the amount of solar generation there is. On sunny days in California (the state with the most BEVs) the demand curve drops significantly from solar generation, creating what is called a \"duck\" curve.

Look it up. You can probably learn a lot if you try reading about it.

I doubt I would ever have a BEV. Not paying thousands more for a car
over a gas one .

I think that is a wise idea for you. You probably would not be able to adapt to a change in paradigm. By the time electric cars have pushed out the ICE in 20 years, you will be long dead. Essentially, nothing you do from this point on will make any difference to anyone. No one cares what you do.

At my age (72) I may have already bought my last car, a 2017 and 2007
truck with only 75,000 miles on it. The wife has a 2020 car with less
than 5000 miles on it. For me, time is too short to worry about when and
where to plug in and wait while there are plenty of gas stations.

Just don\'t live too long. In 10 to 15 years, you will find the number of gas stations to decline seriously. But then you probably won\'t still be driving, and possibly not much else either. Yeah, your life expectancy is only 13 more years. Enjoy it while you can. If your wife is the same age, she will likely get to see the gas stations mostly closed.

--

Rick C.

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