Deepwater Oil Spill - Oh Shit...

[Winfield Hill]

If you like, a little background.
An Introduction to Drilling Offshore Oil Wells
http://www.treesfullofmoney.com/?p=1610

What's really going on with BP's well head?
The Deepwater Oil Spill - Oh Shit...

http://www.theoildrum.com/node/6593/648967
"stuck with a wide open gusher blowing out
150,000 barrels a day of raw oil or more."

I also found the comments interesting. There
has been very little about this in the press.
Here's one story, is it the only one?
Could Damaged Oil Well Casing Lead to Underwater Tar Pit?
http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-31727_162-20006706-10391695.html


--
Thanks,
- Win

 

[amdx]

"Winfield Hill" <Winfield_member@newsguy.com> wrote in message
news:hvfue5018tj@drn.newsguy.com...

If you like, a little background.
An Introduction to Drilling Offshore Oil Wells
http://www.treesfullofmoney.com/?p=1610

What's really going on with BP's well head?
The Deepwater Oil Spill - Oh Shit...

http://www.theoildrum.com/node/6593/648967
"stuck with a wide open gusher blowing out
150,000 barrels a day of raw oil or more."

I also found the comments interesting. There
has been very little about this in the press.
Here's one story, is it the only one?
Could Damaged Oil Well Casing Lead to Underwater Tar Pit?
http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-31727_162-20006706-10391695.html


--
Thanks,
- Win
One thought about the cracks in the well casing, the casing is open at

the top,
this would make me think most of the oil is flowing from the top of the
casing and
not flowing into the geological formation.
Once the relief wells are drilled and they can relieve the flow from the
original well
they should be able to seal the casing with concrete and stop any flow from
cracks
in the casing. But that's just thinking from someone in the seafood business
on the
gulf coast.

This mornings newspaper headline "Significant oil 32 miles away"

Did you watch this 60 minutes video?
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2010/05/16/60minutes/main6490197.shtml
It is in two parts on left side of page, part one is how the chief
electronics technician
heard the problem and saved his life, part two is what he saw in the weeks
before
the explosion. I was locked on this when it first aired. Strange to me I
have not seen
any other media relate the same info.
Mike
PS. I'm not happy that the government strong armed $20 billion from BP. This
only made BP
weaker financially. If BP stays strong they can continue to earn $10 to $25
billion each year
for the next 10 years and pay for the cleanup. If the government continues
to talk BP down
and they go bankrupt, the bill will be on the taxpayers shoulders.
I had more faith hat BP would pay for any losses I may have than the federal
government.

 

[StickThatInYourPipeAndSmo]

On Fri, 18 Jun 2010 10:30:34 -0500, "amdx" <amdx@knology.net> wrote:

"Winfield Hill" <Winfield_member@newsguy.com> wrote in message
news:hvfue5018tj@drn.newsguy.com...

If you like, a little background.
An Introduction to Drilling Offshore Oil Wells
http://www.treesfullofmoney.com/?p=1610

What's really going on with BP's well head?
The Deepwater Oil Spill - Oh Shit...

http://www.theoildrum.com/node/6593/648967
"stuck with a wide open gusher blowing out
150,000 barrels a day of raw oil or more."

I also found the comments interesting. There
has been very little about this in the press.
Here's one story, is it the only one?
Could Damaged Oil Well Casing Lead to Underwater Tar Pit?
http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-31727_162-20006706-10391695.html


--
Thanks,
- Win
One thought about the cracks in the well casing, the casing is open at
the top,
this would make me think most of the oil is flowing from the top of the
casing and
not flowing into the geological formation.
Once the relief wells are drilled and they can relieve the flow from the
original well
they should be able to seal the casing with concrete and stop any flow from
cracks
in the casing. But that's just thinking from someone in the seafood business
on the
gulf coast.

This mornings newspaper headline "Significant oil 32 miles away"

Did you watch this 60 minutes video?
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2010/05/16/60minutes/main6490197.shtml
It is in two parts on left side of page, part one is how the chief
electronics technician
heard the problem and saved his life, part two is what he saw in the weeks
before
the explosion. I was locked on this when it first aired. Strange to me I
have not seen
any other media relate the same info.
Mike
PS. I'm not happy that the government strong armed $20 billion from BP. This
only made BP
weaker financially. If BP stays strong they can continue to earn $10 to $25
billion each year
for the next 10 years and pay for the cleanup. If the government continues
to talk BP down
and they go bankrupt, the bill will be on the taxpayers shoulders.
I had more faith hat BP would pay for any losses I may have than the federal
government.


Unlike with FEMA and the Katria claims fiasco, BP was paying claims

from day one!

I wish folks would stop relying on incomplete, sensationalized new
services' reports.

Nobody here can tell me what BP did on day one.

I SAY that they mobilized efforts immediately. Large assets take time
to move, and these WERE on the move, or they would have arrived later
than they did.

I SAY that Washington was also right on it, because doing otherwise
would be a bad move, and he knew that.

Neither party called up ANY news agency and reported all the things that
they WERE doing.

Only dopey fucks among the citizenry draw conclusions based on the
obviously incomplete data set that the news is relying on to "inform" us.

I say, that the "information" is so badly distorted and incomplete,
they the new is largely responsible for ALL the downturns that the world
has suffered in the last decade!

Many of them get it wrong, despite all the information they have
sitting right in front of them. Many of them are so bad that they do not
even understand what they are reporting on.

In the past, producers caught the things I see, and made corrections.
These days, the producers are nearly as dumb as the reporters, because
they sit idly by.

Same exact thing happens in the LEO realm. NONE of the intelligent
cops point ANY fingers at the flood of absolutely retarded Nazi pigs they
have on their forces these days. So, even the intelligent ones are
guilty of crimes.

It should be a crime for an intelligent man to desire to work ion law
enforcement these days, when one notes all the abuse and lack of
punishment among their ranks.

NO, they are NOT "our finest". If they are, we are all in for a sad
century.

Essentially, this entire planet, and the entire species of man,
deserves nothing less than a rock 1/4 the size of the moon hitting us.

God, and the Lord should have done so a couple millennia ago.

He probably did, it just takes the rock a while to get here.

We deserve whatever calamities we get. Man has been so complacent in
so many places, and most are so goddamned sociocentric that there is
absolutely no hope that we will ever achieve a truly civil, free society.

 

[George Jefferson]

"Winfield Hill" <Winfield_member@newsguy.com> wrote in message
news:hvfue5018tj@drn.newsguy.com...

If you like, a little background.
An Introduction to Drilling Offshore Oil Wells
http://www.treesfullofmoney.com/?p=1610

What's really going on with BP's well head?
The Deepwater Oil Spill - Oh Shit...

http://www.theoildrum.com/node/6593/648967
"stuck with a wide open gusher blowing out
150,000 barrels a day of raw oil or more."

I also found the comments interesting. There
has been very little about this in the press.
Here's one story, is it the only one?
Could Damaged Oil Well Casing Lead to Underwater Tar Pit?
http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-31727_162-20006706-10391695.html


--

I think they are simply looking at new cheaper methods to get the oil to the
surface.

 

[Winfield Hill]

amdx wrote...

PS. I'm not happy that the government strong armed $20 billion from BP.
This only made BP weaker financially. If BP stays strong they can
continue to earn $10 to $25 billion each year ...

As I understand it, the $20B is to be $5B/year for 4 years.
That's half the dividend payout that BP normally makes, which
they are suspending. So by itself $5B/yr could not make them
weaker. It does mean an independent party will make payment
determinations, rather than BP or the gov't, which should
hopefully be better for the shoreline and disaster victims.

As for bankruptcy, BP's assets and cash flow $$ swamp the
numbers we're talking about here. The disturbing thing about
"The Oil Drum" guy's analysis is if he's right, $20B may not
begin to cover the costs. One thing, a 4-year BP deposit rate
makes more sense with a scenario that goes on and on and on.


--
Thanks,
- Win

 

[Archimedes' Lever]

On 18 Jun 2010 09:36:52 -0700, Winfield Hill
<Winfield_member@newsguy.com> wrote:

amdx wrote...

PS. I'm not happy that the government strong armed $20 billion from BP.
This only made BP weaker financially. If BP stays strong they can
continue to earn $10 to $25 billion each year ...

As I understand it, the $20B is to be $5B/year for 4 years.
That's half the dividend payout that BP normally makes, which
they are suspending. So by itself $5B/yr could not make them
weaker. It does mean an independent party will make payment
determinations, rather than BP or the gov't, which should
hopefully be better for the shoreline and disaster victims.

As for bankruptcy, BP's assets and cash flow $$ swamp the
numbers we're talking about here. The disturbing thing about
"The Oil Drum" guy's analysis is if he's right, $20B may not
begin to cover the costs. One thing, a 4-year BP deposit rate
makes more sense with a scenario that goes on and on and on.

This spill will cost more than Bill Gates is (or was) worth.

It will last for more than a decade as well.

 

[George Jefferson]

There are many methods to quickly stop the spill but none are being used.
While I don't like to be a conspiracy theorist I don't really have a problem
with it considering what has gone on with 9/11(IIRC 30% of Americans believe
the government was involved).

It seems too much of a coincidence that the explosion happened exactly at
the time Obama needed something like this to happen to get this draconian
environmental agenda through. Even if this weren't the case considering the
response shows extreme incompetence. Everyone knows what was done wrong so I
don't need to reiterate it. If you believe Obama is a genius then either he
is exploiting the oil spill or created it. If not then he is simply
incompetent and should not be president.

If there is a conspiracy then it's not necessarily obvious why BP would go
along with such a thing until you think about the whole picture. Cap n
trade, a foreign company that has the largest investment in energy in the
world, an obvious lack of motivation to solve the problem(similar to the
governments). In the end, if this is true, BP will be the only one left
standing(as it was design to be).

Now, when we compare this with the 9/11 theory there is much more reason to
believe it. With 9/11 it is all just suspicion but here was have proof of
something(incompetence or conspiracy). Of course I here nothing about a
conspiracy anywhere. I guess conspiracies can only happen under a
conservative/republican government?

 

[Pieyed Piper]

On Fri, 18 Jun 2010 11:58:28 -0500, "George Jefferson"
<phreon111@gmail.com> wrote:

There are many methods to quickly stop the spill but none are being used.

Name a few. Hell, name ONE!

Criteria:

1) 15,000 psi well head issue @ 5000ft under the sea.

2) Quickly stop


I bet you can't.

While I don't like to be a conspiracy theorist I don't really have a problem
with it considering what has gone on with 9/11(IIRC 30% of Americans believe
the government was involved).

Jeez, you aren't a goddamned Rosie O'Retard minion are you?

It seems too much of a coincidence that the explosion happened exactly at
the time Obama needed something like this to happen to get this draconian
environmental agenda through.

Now that, considering the person, I could believe. Remember, this is
the same oath denying, unamerican bastard that claimed under oath that he
did not know Ayers.

He should be in jail for perjury, not sitting in the oval office.

Even if this weren't the case considering the
response shows extreme incompetence. Everyone knows what was done wrong so I
don't need to reiterate it. If you believe Obama is a genius then either he
is exploiting the oil spill or created it. If not then he is simply
incompetent and should not be president.

He IS an incompetent, and has no clue as to the big picture in
AMYTHING, much less this fiasco.

Of course, the non-US citizen assshole should NOT be our president.

If there is a conspiracy then it's not necessarily obvious why BP would go
along with such a thing until you think about the whole picture.

They would never do so. If it was done intentionally, then the party
that did it did not get BP on the bus for the job.

Cap n
trade, a foreign company that has the largest investment in energy in the
world, an obvious lack of motivation to solve the problem(similar to the
governments). In the end, if this is true, BP will be the only one left
standing(as it was design to be).

Huh? You are saying that the other oil companies are going to fail?

Now, when we compare this with the 9/11 theory there is much more reason to
believe it.

You really are a goddamned idiot. Do you also think that no plane hit
the Pentagon? Do you also think that we did not go to the moon?

With 9/11 it is all just suspicion but here was have proof of
something(incompetence or conspiracy). Of course I here nothing about a
conspiracy anywhere. I guess conspiracies can only happen under a
conservative/republican government?

You bark some pretty stupid crap, boy. Pretty fucking meaningless too.

So, tell us, oh mechanical master, how do we "stop it quickly"?

 

[linnix]

On Jun 18, 7:04 am, Winfield Hill <Winfield_mem...@newsguy.com>
wrote:

If you like, a little background.
An Introduction to Drilling Offshore Oil Wellshttp://www.treesfullofmoney..com/?p=1610

What's really going on with BP's well head?
The Deepwater Oil Spill - Oh Shit...

They expected (or hoped, prayed) that the pressure would drop from the
initial 15,000 psi to more manageable level (the casing was tested to
7000 psi). However, with the oil cavity collasping or leaking, it is
not happening. We might have a couple billion barrels of oil to fill
the Dead Sea of Mexico.

http://www.theoildrum.com/node/6593/648967
"stuck with a wide open gusher blowing out
150,000 barrels a day of raw oil or more."

That's probably both oil and gas. So, 25% or around 40,000 barrels of
oil per day. It will run out in around 130 years.

 

[amdx]

"StickThatInYourPipeAndSmokeIt" <Zarathustra@thusspoke.org> wrote in message
news:e75n169prmi4ej3dajvlmb6s3r6b4bjg8f@4ax.com...

On Fri, 18 Jun 2010 10:30:34 -0500, "amdx" <amdx@knology.net> wrote:


"Winfield Hill" <Winfield_member@newsguy.com> wrote in message
news:hvfue5018tj@drn.newsguy.com...

If you like, a little background.
An Introduction to Drilling Offshore Oil Wells
http://www.treesfullofmoney.com/?p=1610

What's really going on with BP's well head?
The Deepwater Oil Spill - Oh Shit...

http://www.theoildrum.com/node/6593/648967
"stuck with a wide open gusher blowing out
150,000 barrels a day of raw oil or more."

I also found the comments interesting. There
has been very little about this in the press.
Here's one story, is it the only one?
Could Damaged Oil Well Casing Lead to Underwater Tar Pit?
http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-31727_162-20006706-10391695.html


--
Thanks,
- Win
One thought about the cracks in the well casing, the casing is open at
the top,
this would make me think most of the oil is flowing from the top of the
casing and
not flowing into the geological formation.
Once the relief wells are drilled and they can relieve the flow from the
original well
they should be able to seal the casing with concrete and stop any flow
from
cracks
in the casing. But that's just thinking from someone in the seafood
business
on the
gulf coast.

This mornings newspaper headline "Significant oil 32 miles away"

Did you watch this 60 minutes video?
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2010/05/16/60minutes/main6490197.shtml
It is in two parts on left side of page, part one is how the chief
electronics technician
heard the problem and saved his life, part two is what he saw in the weeks
before
the explosion. I was locked on this when it first aired. Strange to me I
have not seen
any other media relate the same info.
Mike
PS. I'm not happy that the government strong armed $20 billion from BP.
This
only made BP
weaker financially. If BP stays strong they can continue to earn $10 to
$25
billion each year
for the next 10 years and pay for the cleanup. If the government continues
to talk BP down
and they go bankrupt, the bill will be on the taxpayers shoulders.
I had more faith hat BP would pay for any losses I may have than the
federal
government.


Unlike with FEMA and the Katria claims fiasco, BP was paying claims
from day one!

I wish folks would stop relying on incomplete, sensationalized new
services' reports.

Nobody here can tell me what BP did on day one.

I'm confused by what you said, I can't tell if you think BP was

spreading money out quickly or not. Here in PC, Fl. money was
flowing 6 or 8 weeks before the oil was here, and it still is not
on our beaches. From my perspective it looks like lot's of money
is being spent. My business is still doing well, but the writing is
on the wall, "The end is near"
I just hope BP still has assets if/when I start to have loses.
Mike

 

[amdx]

While I don't like to be a conspiracy theorist ....

I don't believe in them at all.

It seems too much of a coincidence that the explosion happened exactly at
the time Obama needed something like this to happen to get this draconian
environmental agenda through.

On the other hand, this is obviously a conspiracy that Obama propagated!

Tongue firmly in cheek.
Mike

 

[Archimedes' Lever]

On Fri, 18 Jun 2010 14:26:53 -0500, "amdx" <amdx@knology.net> wrote:

"StickThatInYourPipeAndSmokeIt" <Zarathustra@thusspoke.org> wrote in message
news:e75n169prmi4ej3dajvlmb6s3r6b4bjg8f@4ax.com...
On Fri, 18 Jun 2010 10:30:34 -0500, "amdx" <amdx@knology.net> wrote:


"Winfield Hill" <Winfield_member@newsguy.com> wrote in message
news:hvfue5018tj@drn.newsguy.com...

If you like, a little background.
An Introduction to Drilling Offshore Oil Wells
http://www.treesfullofmoney.com/?p=1610

What's really going on with BP's well head?
The Deepwater Oil Spill - Oh Shit...

http://www.theoildrum.com/node/6593/648967
"stuck with a wide open gusher blowing out
150,000 barrels a day of raw oil or more."

I also found the comments interesting. There
has been very little about this in the press.
Here's one story, is it the only one?
Could Damaged Oil Well Casing Lead to Underwater Tar Pit?
http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-31727_162-20006706-10391695.html


--
Thanks,
- Win
One thought about the cracks in the well casing, the casing is open at
the top,
this would make me think most of the oil is flowing from the top of the
casing and
not flowing into the geological formation.
Once the relief wells are drilled and they can relieve the flow from the
original well
they should be able to seal the casing with concrete and stop any flow
from
cracks
in the casing. But that's just thinking from someone in the seafood
business
on the
gulf coast.

This mornings newspaper headline "Significant oil 32 miles away"

Did you watch this 60 minutes video?
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2010/05/16/60minutes/main6490197.shtml
It is in two parts on left side of page, part one is how the chief
electronics technician
heard the problem and saved his life, part two is what he saw in the weeks
before
the explosion. I was locked on this when it first aired. Strange to me I
have not seen
any other media relate the same info.
Mike
PS. I'm not happy that the government strong armed $20 billion from BP.
This
only made BP
weaker financially. If BP stays strong they can continue to earn $10 to
$25
billion each year
for the next 10 years and pay for the cleanup. If the government continues
to talk BP down
and they go bankrupt, the bill will be on the taxpayers shoulders.
I had more faith hat BP would pay for any losses I may have than the
federal
government.


Unlike with FEMA and the Katria claims fiasco, BP was paying claims
from day one!

I wish folks would stop relying on incomplete, sensationalized new
services' reports.

Nobody here can tell me what BP did on day one.

I'm confused by what you said, I can't tell if you think BP was
spreading money out quickly or not. Here in PC, Fl. money was
flowing 6 or 8 weeks before the oil was here, and it still is not
on our beaches. From my perspective it looks like lot's of money
is being spent. My business is still doing well, but the writing is
on the wall, "The end is near"
I just hope BP still has assets if/when I start to have loses.
Mike

I am saying that they mobilized ships immediately. It was in their best
interests to do so. They have exactly zero reasons to have done
otherwise.

They also began paying claims immediately once received, though I am not
sure what their validation criteria has been.

What this whole thing is mostly indicative of is just how gullible, and
suggestion compliant most folks are these days. They see some crap on
the news and write it down in stone in their heads as fact.

They suffer the same delusion regarding cops and believing their
horseshit that they are all truth sayers and beyond reproach.

They are beyond reproach, but is an artificial cloak, when one
considers that they do commit crimes. Sum ting wong.

This country has taken big steps backward in their educational prowess.
Too much discipline tells me that we should go back to gender segregated
paradigms. Then maybe we can begin to give kids back their morals and
values, and actually give them years of education instead of years of
consternation.

We should be disciplining the governments and the cops. THEY are the
ones that still eat steak 3 nights a week in this country. THEY are the
ones that never suffer during an economic downturn because they are the
ones that have succeeded in re-creating yet another failed democracy due
to abject fucking greed.

The folks running this country deserve nothing less than a monster
smack down by someone that actually knows what is going on in the big
picture.

They are damaging this country, and that will subsequently damage all
the progress we have made of the centuries toward making the world
poverty free, red, and properly governed.

It was a nice try, but unless you guys put someone up there to kick
some lame politician ass, we will NEVER recover from the spiral they are
currently trying to shove us over the event horizon of.

 

[amdx]

"Archimedes' Lever" <OneBigLever@InfiniteSeries.Org> wrote in message
news:lpin165sljbl2ar5hsupfgdhpvhtf91u10@4ax.com...

On Fri, 18 Jun 2010 14:26:53 -0500, "amdx" <amdx@knology.net> wrote:


"StickThatInYourPipeAndSmokeIt" <Zarathustra@thusspoke.org> wrote in
message
news:e75n169prmi4ej3dajvlmb6s3r6b4bjg8f@4ax.com...
On Fri, 18 Jun 2010 10:30:34 -0500, "amdx" <amdx@knology.net> wrote:


"Winfield Hill" <Winfield_member@newsguy.com> wrote in message
news:hvfue5018tj@drn.newsguy.com...

If you like, a little background.
An Introduction to Drilling Offshore Oil Wells
http://www.treesfullofmoney.com/?p=1610

What's really going on with BP's well head?
The Deepwater Oil Spill - Oh Shit...

http://www.theoildrum.com/node/6593/648967
"stuck with a wide open gusher blowing out
150,000 barrels a day of raw oil or more."

I also found the comments interesting. There
has been very little about this in the press.
Here's one story, is it the only one?
Could Damaged Oil Well Casing Lead to Underwater Tar Pit?
http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-31727_162-20006706-10391695.html


--
Thanks,
- Win
One thought about the cracks in the well casing, the casing is open
at
the top,
this would make me think most of the oil is flowing from the top of the
casing and
not flowing into the geological formation.
Once the relief wells are drilled and they can relieve the flow from
the
original well
they should be able to seal the casing with concrete and stop any flow
from
cracks
in the casing. But that's just thinking from someone in the seafood
business
on the
gulf coast.

This mornings newspaper headline "Significant oil 32 miles away"

Did you watch this 60 minutes video?
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2010/05/16/60minutes/main6490197.shtml
It is in two parts on left side of page, part one is how the chief
electronics technician
heard the problem and saved his life, part two is what he saw in the
weeks
before
the explosion. I was locked on this when it first aired. Strange to me I
have not seen
any other media relate the same info.
Mike
PS. I'm not happy that the government strong armed $20 billion from BP.
This
only made BP
weaker financially. If BP stays strong they can continue to earn $10 to
$25
billion each year
for the next 10 years and pay for the cleanup. If the government
continues
to talk BP down
and they go bankrupt, the bill will be on the taxpayers shoulders.
I had more faith hat BP would pay for any losses I may have than the
federal
government.


Unlike with FEMA and the Katria claims fiasco, BP was paying claims
from day one!

I wish folks would stop relying on incomplete, sensationalized new
services' reports.

Nobody here can tell me what BP did on day one.

I'm confused by what you said, I can't tell if you think BP was
spreading money out quickly or not. Here in PC, Fl. money was
flowing 6 or 8 weeks before the oil was here, and it still is not
on our beaches. From my perspective it looks like lot's of money
is being spent. My business is still doing well, but the writing is
on the wall, "The end is near"
I just hope BP still has assets if/when I start to have loses.
Mike


I am saying that they mobilized ships immediately. It was in their best
interests to do so. They have exactly zero reasons to have done
otherwise.

They also began paying claims immediately once received, though I am not
sure what their validation criteria has been.

Ok you and I are on the same page.

When the office first opened up in P.C. Beach Fl. the criteria was nill.
I know of one lazy bum that got his first check for $2,500 to cover losses,
the guy didn't earn $5,000 all last year, he didn't have losses. His
welfare,
food stamp collecting girl friend collected $1,000. Both are fraudulent but
at least he did clean a few fish last year. She had no income except from
the taxpayers. It is time for their next check, may have already got it.
Next were the shrimpers, no oil, plenty of shrimp, price is up, but many
owners went and got $5,000 and the deckhands $2,500, but they actually
had more income. To be fair some of the shrimpers and fishermen deserve
to get checks, as their fishing/shrimping grounds are contaminated and they
have lost income and a way of life. And then there are some that got their
check and continue to fish.
Here's an article in my local paper that illustrates the high pay BP is
giving.
http://www.newsherald.com/news/checks-84528-apalachicola-compensation.html

I have been on a rant the last week, don't know if you noticed any of my
posts
but here is a letter I sent out regarding the BP $20 billion escrow fund. It
was
to little to late.

Dear Senator,

My wife and I have a small store where we have been selling shrimp from for
11 years. Our store is actually a boat in St. Andrews Marina. Everyday
fishermen hired by BP are going out in search of oil. I see 30 to 50 boats
leave every morning. Many (it should be most*) of these are fishermen that
have lost there means of making a living. BP has hired them and is paying
them well. At this time we have no oil in Panama City.

MY FIRST POINT, don't do anything that will affect the financial viability
of BP. You should encourage purchase of BP fuel, you need to keep BP healthy
so the stock price can rise, this makes BP stronger so it can continue to
pay cleanup crews and claims.

I am on this marina everyday and I know most of the fishermen, the fisherman
are thrilled with the pay from BP.

A small boat of 20ft gets $1000 dollars day, This is $250,000 a year for a 5
day work week. Fuel and supplies are paid by BP. The larger the boat the
higher the pay, $3000 a day is the highest I have heard. That's $750,000 a
year, and the expenses are paid. Deckhands are getting $200 dollars a day,
that is $50,000 a year. Most of these deckhands never saw $20,000 a year in
there life.

The pay is so high that the shrimpers are stopping shrimping and going to
work for BP, on oil patrol. The same is happening in Apalachicola Fl, (about
100 miles SE of me) the oyster capitol of this area. Our local oyster bar
had to find a new source for oysters, his oystermen went to work for BP.

A quote from our local newspaper,

"APALACHICOLA - With compensation checks easily available, oystering has
slowed to a crawl on Apalachicola Bay. ...Seafood houses across the county
say they are able to obtain barely 10 percent of their normal allotment of
oysters. There are plenty of oysters. ( just know one to harvest them)

Same with Apalachicola shrimpers, There is no oil and plenty of shrimp.

Panama City Beach is a tourist area, when the oil gets here the thousands of
hotel rooms will not have tourists, the housekeepers won't have work, the
restaurants won't have customers and waitresses tips will dwindle. All
business will be affected. Real estate is already greatly affected, people
don't want to buy with oil coming and some know prices will be lower in 3 or
4 months.

Now back to my situation, for the last 7 years we have been open 10 hrs a
day, 7 days a week, 363 days a year.

We will continue working until we can't. The plan was 7 to 10 more years,
now I don't know if it will be one more month or one more year. At this
point I am confident BP will pay for any losses that I may have in the
future, but they need to continue to be financially strong.

I'm sure you're aware that the BP stock price is down 44% since the spill
started. This means they have lost 73 billion in market capitalization. It
is time to help the company recover rather than do anything that could
affect the price further.

Many retirees rely on BP dividends for retirement income. If you push the
idea to create an escrow fund and cause the dividend to be unpaid, this will
lower the stock price, further weakening the company. Without those
dividends the retirees will find other stocks to get there income**.

This could cause BP to fail.

If you allow BP to stay strong, the 15 to 20 billion dollars of profit they
generate every year will be more

than enough to pay cleanup and claims.

Please stay focused on the unintended consequences of creating an escrow
fund.

Sincerely,

Mike Knowlton

**Recreational fisherman are jumping on this gravy train, it should have
been commercial

fishermen first. Retirees are supplementing their retirement with their
recreational fishing boat.





** ( starting with 44% less money)

 

[Paul E. Schoen]

"amdx" <amdx@knology.net> wrote in message
news:8374e$4c1be0c1$18d66003$16816@KNOLOGY.NET...

Ok you and I are on the same page.
When the office first opened up in P.C. Beach Fl. the criteria was nill.
I know of one lazy bum that got his first check for $2,500 to cover
losses,
the guy didn't earn $5,000 all last year, he didn't have losses. His
welfare,
food stamp collecting girl friend collected $1,000. Both are fraudulent
but
at least he did clean a few fish last year. She had no income except from
the taxpayers. It is time for their next check, may have already got it.
Next were the shrimpers, no oil, plenty of shrimp, price is up, but many
owners went and got $5,000 and the deckhands $2,500, but they actually
had more income. To be fair some of the shrimpers and fishermen deserve
to get checks, as their fishing/shrimping grounds are contaminated and
they
have lost income and a way of life. And then there are some that got their
check and continue to fish.
Here's an article in my local paper that illustrates the high pay BP is
giving.
http://www.newsherald.com/news/checks-84528-apalachicola-compensation.html

I have been on a rant the last week, don't know if you noticed any of my
posts but here is a letter I sent out regarding the BP $20 billion escrow
fund. It was to little to late.

Dear Senator,

My wife and I have a small store where we have been selling shrimp from
for
11 years. Our store is actually a boat in St. Andrews Marina. Everyday
fishermen hired by BP are going out in search of oil. I see 30 to 50 boats
leave every morning. Many (it should be most*) of these are fishermen that
have lost there means of making a living. BP has hired them and is paying
them well. At this time we have no oil in Panama City.

MY FIRST POINT, don't do anything that will affect the financial viability
of BP. You should encourage purchase of BP fuel, you need to keep BP
healthy
so the stock price can rise, this makes BP stronger so it can continue to
pay cleanup crews and claims.

I am on this marina everyday and I know most of the fishermen, the
fisherman
are thrilled with the pay from BP.

A small boat of 20ft gets $1000 dollars day, This is $250,000 a year for a
5
day work week. Fuel and supplies are paid by BP. The larger the boat the
higher the pay, $3000 a day is the highest I have heard. That's $750,000 a
year, and the expenses are paid. Deckhands are getting $200 dollars a day,
that is $50,000 a year. Most of these deckhands never saw $20,000 a year
in
there life.

The pay is so high that the shrimpers are stopping shrimping and going to
work for BP, on oil patrol. The same is happening in Apalachicola Fl,
(about
100 miles SE of me) the oyster capitol of this area. Our local oyster bar
had to find a new source for oysters, his oystermen went to work for BP.

A quote from our local newspaper,

"APALACHICOLA - With compensation checks easily available, oystering has
slowed to a crawl on Apalachicola Bay. ...Seafood houses across the county
say they are able to obtain barely 10 percent of their normal allotment of
oysters. There are plenty of oysters. ( just know one to harvest them)

Same with Apalachicola shrimpers, There is no oil and plenty of shrimp.

Panama City Beach is a tourist area, when the oil gets here the thousands
of
hotel rooms will not have tourists, the housekeepers won't have work, the
restaurants won't have customers and waitresses tips will dwindle. All
business will be affected. Real estate is already greatly affected, people
don't want to buy with oil coming and some know prices will be lower in 3
or
4 months.

Now back to my situation, for the last 7 years we have been open 10 hrs a
day, 7 days a week, 363 days a year.

We will continue working until we can't. The plan was 7 to 10 more years,
now I don't know if it will be one more month or one more year. At this
point I am confident BP will pay for any losses that I may have in the
future, but they need to continue to be financially strong.

I'm sure you're aware that the BP stock price is down 44% since the spill
started. This means they have lost 73 billion in market capitalization. It
is time to help the company recover rather than do anything that could
affect the price further.

Many retirees rely on BP dividends for retirement income. If you push the
idea to create an escrow fund and cause the dividend to be unpaid, this
will
lower the stock price, further weakening the company. Without those
dividends the retirees will find other stocks to get there income**.

This could cause BP to fail.

If you allow BP to stay strong, the 15 to 20 billion dollars of profit
they
generate every year will be more

than enough to pay cleanup and claims.

Please stay focused on the unintended consequences of creating an escrow
fund.

Sincerely,

Mike Knowlton

**Recreational fisherman are jumping on this gravy train, it should have
been commercial

fishermen first. Retirees are supplementing their retirement with their
recreational fishing boat.

** ( starting with 44% less money)

The Oildrum link was broken, and thre were many threads that were closed due
to high volume of comments. This seems to be validand active:
http://www.theoildrum.com/node/6604

There is a lot of technical information but it seems apparent that corners
were cut to save money and time. I agree that BP should not be forced into
insolvency for this tragedy, and it was really just a roll of the dice that
they were the ones to have this happen in such a big way at this time. I'm
sure most other companies were/are doing the same thing, although now they
are probably going back and tightening things up for a while.

There should be some contribution from the other companies involved in all
similar sorts of drilling and oil extraction. Maybe BP should pay the lion's
share, but there should be an investigation of the other companies, and
unless they can prove a much higher standard of safety over the last several
years, and an impeccable track record, they should also contribute to the
escrow fund. And all companies should be forced to invest a considerable
amount toward new safety measures and inspections to minimize the danger of
a future catastrophe. There have been other accidents before and after this
major event, but they did not have the "perfect storm" set of circumstances
to cause so much damage.

This is one way to make sure the other companies do not get an unfair
advantage just because they have been lucky so far. I planned to boycott BP
just as I did with Exxon after the Alaska spill. But it was really
inconsequential especially since I no longer drive much and my vehicles
average 30-35 MPG. What is really needed is an overall drop in consumption
that will lower demand and cause prices to drop across the board and affect
all companies equally. The other way to make it fair is to impose a stiff
tax of $1-$2 per gallon or more, and use that revenue to fund alternative
energies and better efficiencies, and take care of this and other
environmental calamities that exist or will happen in the future.

There are many ways to achieve a more sustainable energy future, and each of
us must be willing to make a sacrifice. We may need to choose a little pain
now or worse pain in the future.

Paul

 

[linnix]

On Jun 18, 4:58 pm, "George Jefferson" <phreon...@gmail.com> wrote:

There are many methods to quickly stop the spill but none are being used.

They have all been tested and failed before. Top hat, top kill and
top pipe were all tried in Mexico and other wells. BP knew they won't
work, but have to show something to the public. The PEMX spill was
capped with relief well 10 months later. So, we could be looking at
early next year. However, PEMEX was fixing it in 200 feet, not 5000
feet and they did not have other leaks in and out of the cavity.

 

[Bill Bowden]

On Jun 18, 9:58 am, "George Jefferson" <phreon...@gmail.com> wrote:

There are many methods to quickly stop the spill but none are being used.
While I don't like to be a conspiracy theorist I don't really have a problem
with it considering what has gone on with 9/11(IIRC 30% of Americans believe
the government was involved).

It seems too much of a coincidence that the explosion happened exactly at
the time Obama needed something like this to happen to get this draconian
environmental agenda through. Even if this weren't the case considering the
response shows extreme incompetence. Everyone knows what was done wrong so I
don't need to reiterate it. If you believe Obama is a genius then either he
is exploiting the oil spill or created it. If not then he is simply
incompetent and should not be president.

If there is a conspiracy then it's not necessarily obvious why BP would go
along with such a thing until you think about the whole picture. Cap n
trade, a foreign company that has the largest investment in energy in the
world, an obvious lack of motivation to solve the problem(similar to the
governments). In the end, if this is true, BP will be the only one left
standing(as it was design to be).

Now, when we compare this with the 9/11 theory there is much more reason to
believe it. With 9/11 it is all just suspicion but here was have proof of
something(incompetence or conspiracy). Of course I here nothing about a
conspiracy anywhere. I guess conspiracies can only happen under a
conservative/republican government?

The oil spill wasn't a conspiracy, just lack of quality control. Final
quality control tests sometimes show up intermittent problems, only to
have the test re-run where the problem goes away, and the unit gets
shipped. Everybody wants to go to lunch early.

-Bill

 

[Grumps]

"George Jefferson" <phreon111@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:hvg8j6$4ie$1@news.eternal-september.org...
<snippy snip snip>

If there is a conspiracy then it's not necessarily obvious why BP would go
along with such a thing until you think about the whole picture. Cap n
trade, a foreign company

Foreign company? Was the DWH not operated by BP America, a US registered
company?

that has the largest investment in energy in the world, an obvious lack of
motivation to solve the problem(similar to the governments). In the end,
if this is true, BP will be the only one left standing(as it was design to
be).

<and snip the rest too>

 

[Michael A. Terrell]

Grumps wrote:

"George Jefferson" <phreon111@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:hvg8j6$4ie$1@news.eternal-september.org...
snippy snip snip

If there is a conspiracy then it's not necessarily obvious why BP would go
along with such a thing until you think about the whole picture. Cap n
trade, a foreign company

Foreign company? Was the DWH not operated by BP America, a US registered
company?

And fully owned by British petroleum. That's why their spokesweasel
is returning to England.


--
Anyone wanting to run for any political office in the US should have to
have a DD214, and a honorable discharge.

 

[MooseFET]

On Jun 19, 10:36 pm, "Michael A. Terrell" <mike.terr...@earthlink.net>
wrote:

Grumps wrote:

"George Jefferson" <phreon...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:hvg8j6$4ie$1@news.eternal-september.org...
snippy snip snip

If there is a conspiracy then it's not necessarily obvious why BP would go
along with such a thing until you think about the whole picture. Cap n
trade, a foreign company

Foreign company? Was the DWH not operated by BP America, a US registered
company?

And fully owned by British petroleum. That's why their spokesweasel
is returning to England.

Multinational corporations are not really part of any nation. BP is
largely but
not completely owned by the British.

The US registered part could be used as a way to duck out from the
responsibility after things cool off. The main part of BP can pump
the
money out of the US part while making the US part responsible for the
damages. At some point the US part goes bankrupt leaving the US
stuck with the remaining costs.

The 20 Billion set aside doesn't even begin to cover the likely long
term costs. The fishing industry in Alaska still hasn't recovered
after
20 years. When you knock things like fish stocks way down, there is
no telling whether it recovers to the same combination of critters as
it was before.

 

[amdx]

"MooseFET" <kensmith@rahul.net> wrote in message
news:3dc8cf08-35f0-4778-a677-570da7141661@t26g2000prt.googlegroups.com...

On Jun 19, 10:36 pm, "Michael A. Terrell" <mike.terr...@earthlink.net
wrote:
Grumps wrote:

"George Jefferson" <phreon...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:hvg8j6$4ie$1@news.eternal-september.org...
snippy snip snip

If there is a conspiracy then it's not necessarily obvious why BP
would go
along with such a thing until you think about the whole picture. Cap
n
trade, a foreign company

Foreign company? Was the DWH not operated by BP America, a US
registered
company?

And fully owned by British petroleum. That's why their spokesweasel
is returning to England.

Multinational corporations are not really part of any nation. BP is
largely but
not completely owned by the British.

The US registered part could be used as a way to duck out from the
responsibility after things cool off. The main part of BP can pump
the
money out of the US part while making the US part responsible for the
damages. At some point the US part goes bankrupt leaving the US
stuck with the remaining costs.

The 20 Billion set aside doesn't even begin to cover the likely long
term costs.

Ya, the government should have let BP keep their $20 billion.
We all need to keep the company financially strong, if they can continue
making $15 billion in profits the next 10 or 20 years they can pay the
losses caused by the oil leak.
But taking $20B form a company that has already lost over $70B in assets
is just weakening them and pushing them toward bankruptcy Bp only had $7B
in cash when the shakedown occurred. Now they need to find a way to get
$13B plus a little more for operating capital.

Mike