Goto page Previous 1, 2, 3
John Tserkezis
Guest
Mon Oct 17, 2011 10:09 am
Bruce Varley wrote:
Quote:
Wth noting that the two towns cited in the article - Exmouth and
Carnarvon - are both relatively small and distant from the main state grids.
AFAIAA both would be reliant on relatively small local generating
facilities, their grid may not be all that stiff.
It's been a while, but the names ring a bell.
Either limited local generation, or long distance cables causing
voltage lag will do it.
I'm thinking it's more likely to be long distance cables.
Wind is out there to supplement peak power use, and that works well,
if you ignore the constant whining and protesting to get the wind
generators taken out, citing noise and eye-soreness as reasons.
Quite sensibly, they are all ignored.
It's easy to leave the wind generators installed and ignore the
whining and protesting
It's hard to remove the wind generation, and ignore screams of blue
bloody murder when they get to their quiet homes, turn on the lights and
barely get a dim glow.
--
The worst thing about censorship is **************************.
David
Guest
Mon Oct 17, 2011 10:14 am
On 17/10/2011 12:07 AM, Phil Allison wrote:
"David is a Professional Electrical Engineer with many years experience
in the power industry"
Quote:
**Care to explain how grid connected inverters are capable of feeding
MORE
than mains Voltage (whether it is a nominal 230VAC or 240VAC) into the
grid?
** No current would flow from the inverter UNLESS it put out more volts
than
were otherwise on the incoming line.
Not true in AC system.
** The topic is domestic premises where load current is normally very close
to being in-phase - and that current exists in the conductors feeding each
premises.
I knew there was no point in explaining this to someone who has no
concept of the difference between phase angle and load angle.
This might be a bit complex for you Phil, but here is a reference for
Wind Generation. Solar is the same:
Quote:
http://books.google.com.au/books?id=3e-WeiLb848C&pg=PA103&lpg=PA103&dq=power+flow+load+angle&source=bl&ots=dFM2Dji-ks&sig=sbms7yUrdW6W0qWhpkxmx7P4ai0&hl=en&ei=PP2bTsDhIoa1iQff_6msAg&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=4&ved=0CDUQ6AEwAzgK#v=onepage&q=power%20flow%20load%20angle&f=false
Refer to top of Page 104.
Quote:
The feed conductors are essentially resistors at 50Hz.
There is a lot more to a power system than "feed conductors", what ever
you mean by that. I take it you are refering to the the consumer mains.
Quote:
So voltage drop determines the direction of flow.
For reactive power, yes. Not for real power. That depends on the load
angle between the load and the generator
Quote:
You fucking tenth with moron.
?????????
In an AC power system, real power flow is determined by the load angle
between the generator and the load.
** Contextless gobbledegook.
I knew you wouldn't understand this. It requires some level of
mathematical understanding. AC power systems are a lot more complex than
Ohms law and toasters.
Quote:
Voltage level differences determines reactive power flow.
** Even worse contextless gobbledegook.
QED
.... David
Phil Allison
Guest
Mon Oct 17, 2011 10:56 am
"David is a trolling Fake "
Quote:
"David is a Professional Electrical Engineer with many years experience in
the power industry"
"David is a LYING trolling Fake "
Quote:
** No current would flow from the inverter UNLESS it put out more volts
than were otherwise on the incoming line.
Not true in AC system.
** The topic is domestic premises where load current is normally very
close
to being in-phase - and that current exists in the conductors feeding
each
premises.
The feed conductors are essentially resistors at 50Hz.
So voltage drop determines the direction of flow.
You fucking tenth witted moron.
In an AC power system, real power flow is determined by the load angle
between the generator and the load.
** Contextless gobbledegook.
Voltage level differences determines reactive power flow.
** Even worse contextless gobbledegook.
** This anonymous " David " fuckwit has never been right, not even once.
He even got the very simple math relating copper resistance to temp rise
completely fouled up.
Cos he is a mentally defective pile of autistic scum.
Yet another revolting, ASD fucked inbreed.
..... Phil
David
Guest
Mon Oct 17, 2011 1:00 pm
A bit complex is it for you Phil? Couldn't understand the link I sent
you? Good thing toasters are purely resistive loads I guess.
Pity you never understood complex numbers and vectors. You might then
understand about AC power sytems.
David
On 17/10/2011 9:56 PM, Phil Allison wrote:
Quote:
"David is a trolling Fake"
"David is a Professional Electrical Engineer with many years experience in
the power industry"
"David is a LYING trolling Fake"
** No current would flow from the inverter UNLESS it put out more volts
than were otherwise on the incoming line.
Not true in AC system.
** The topic is domestic premises where load current is normally very
close
to being in-phase - and that current exists in the conductors feeding
each
premises.
The feed conductors are essentially resistors at 50Hz.
So voltage drop determines the direction of flow.
You fucking tenth witted moron.
In an AC power system, real power flow is determined by the load angle
between the generator and the load.
** Contextless gobbledegook.
Voltage level differences determines reactive power flow.
** Even worse contextless gobbledegook.
** This anonymous " David " fuckwit has never been right, not even once.
He even got the very simple math relating copper resistance to temp rise
completely fouled up.
Cos he is a mentally defective pile of autistic scum.
Yet another revolting, ASD fucked inbreed.
.... Phil
John Tserkezis
Guest
Mon Oct 17, 2011 1:01 pm
Phil Allison wrote:
Quote:
** John Tserkezis is a life long, total nut case.
Like the proverbial Zoo Gorilla, he annoys himself.
So, it is a totally superfluous to annoy him with facts or logic.
They are both forever beyond his comprehension.
FFS - wise up.
Give up Phil. Rod Speed has that market cornered. And he's been
doing it from LONG before *that* condom broke.
--
Everybody wants to go to heaven, but nobody wants to die.
Phil Allison
Guest
Mon Oct 17, 2011 9:26 pm
"David is a trolling Fake "
Quote:
"David is a Professional Electrical Engineer with many years experience in
the power industry"
"David is a LYING trolling Fake "
** This anonymous " David " fuckwit has never been right, not even once.
He even got the very simple math relating copper resistance to temp rise
completely fouled up.
Cos he is a mentally defective pile of autistic scum.
Yet another revolting, ASD fucked inbreed.
..... Phil
Dimmer
Guest
Tue Oct 18, 2011 12:59 am
I wish you blokes would not quote Phil's filth and abuse verbatim. Those of
us who killfiled him to avoid it still have to read it! Doesn't take long
to put in asterisks!
"David" <david_at_usenet.com> wrote in message
news:4e9c26d6$0$10387$c3e8da3$14a0410e_at_news.astraweb.com...
Quote:
A bit complex is it for you Phil? Couldn't understand the link I sent you?
Good thing toasters are purely resistive loads I guess.
Pity you never understood complex numbers and vectors. You might then
understand about AC power sytems.
David
On 17/10/2011 9:56 PM, Phil Allison wrote:
"David is a trolling Fake"
"David is a Professional Electrical Engineer with many years experience
in
the power industry"
"David is a LYING trolling Fake"
** No current would flow from the inverter UNLESS it put out more volts
than were otherwise on the incoming line.
Not true in AC system.
** The topic is domestic premises where load current is normally very
close
to being in-phase - and that current exists in the conductors feeding
each
premises.
The feed conductors are essentially resistors at 50Hz.
So voltage drop determines the direction of flow.
You fucking tenth witted moron.
In an AC power system, real power flow is determined by the load angle
between the generator and the load.
** Contextless gobbledegook.
Voltage level differences determines reactive power flow.
** Even worse contextless gobbledegook.
** This anonymous " David " fuckwit has never been right, not even once.
He even got the very simple math relating copper resistance to temp rise
completely fouled up.
Cos he is a mentally defective pile of autistic scum.
Yet another revolting, ASD fucked inbreed.
.... Phil
Phil Allison
Guest
Tue Oct 18, 2011 1:12 am
"Dimmer"
** Hey - Dimwit.
Go straight to hell you stinking troll.
... Phil
terryc
Guest
Tue Oct 18, 2011 1:26 am
Dimmer wrote:
Quote:
I wish you blokes would not quote Phil's filth and abuse verbatim.
pot kettle black?
snip please.
TonyS
Guest
Fri Oct 21, 2011 8:44 am
On 17/10/2011 5:58 PM, John Tserkezis wrote:
[snipped the lot to start from scratch but show the article link:
http://www.theaustralian.com.au/national-affairs/carbon-plan/rooftop-solar-panels-overloading-electricity-grid/story-fn99tjf2-1226165360822
]
John, I did a little more research on the subject.
A friend of mine has a solar installer licence and has access to
inverter manuals.
I looked at manuals of the German SMA
(http://www.sma-australia.com.au/en_AU/products/solar-inverters/sunny-boy.html)
and the Chinese Sunteams (www.kinglongpower.com)
which are quite common here in WA.
They do switch off (disconnect from the grid by relay) as soon as the
maximal Voltage has been reached (260 or 265 Volts). No info on
hysteresis and recovery time though.
You can tweak this voltage in the setup (but need a password with the
SMA), and so make sure that at least your system keeps feeding (don't!).
If this design is common practice, which I think is safe to assume, the
scenario described by Mr. Hart sounds plausible to me I am afraid, given
that there is not enough copper and/or a high number of solar feeders.
Sylvia Else
Guest
Mon Oct 24, 2011 11:56 am
On 17/10/2011 9:09 PM, John Tserkezis wrote:
Quote:
Bruce Varley wrote:
Wth noting that the two towns cited in the article - Exmouth and
Carnarvon - are both relatively small and distant from the main state
grids.
AFAIAA both would be reliant on relatively small local generating
facilities, their grid may not be all that stiff.
It's been a while, but the names ring a bell.
Either limited local generation, or long distance cables causing voltage
lag will do it.
I'm thinking it's more likely to be long distance cables.
Wind is out there to supplement peak power use, and that works well, if
you ignore the constant whining and protesting to get the wind
generators taken out, citing noise and eye-soreness as reasons.
Quite sensibly, they are all ignored.
It's easy to leave the wind generators installed and ignore the whining
and protesting
It's hard to remove the wind generation, and ignore screams of blue
bloody murder when they get to their quiet homes, turn on the lights and
barely get a dim glow.
Or their complete disbelief when the wind generators are left in place,
and the people turn on their lights, but the wind isn't blowing.
Sylvia.
Goto page Previous 1, 2, 3
