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George Herold
Guest

Thu Feb 07, 2019 3:45 pm   



Hi all, A (mostly clueless) physics type wants to do some RF stuff. (measuring nmr signals.. protons, ~5-25 MHz range) He's got something
working, but construction is ugly. I was thinking of recommending an ARRL handbook, is any version better than others?

Phil Hobbs
Guest

Thu Feb 07, 2019 4:45 pm   



On 2/7/19 9:33 AM, George Herold wrote:
Quote:
Hi all, A (mostly clueless) physics type wants to do some RF stuff. (measuring nmr signals.. protons, ~5-25 MHz range) He's got something
working, but construction is ugly. I was thinking of recommending an ARRL handbook, is any version better than others?


IIRC they took out a lot of the construction project stuff in the early
'90s.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

--
Dr Philip C D Hobbs
Principal Consultant
ElectroOptical Innovations LLC / Hobbs ElectroOptics
Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics
Briarcliff Manor NY 10510

http://electrooptical.net
http://hobbs-eo.com

piglet
Guest

Thu Feb 07, 2019 4:45 pm   



On 07/02/2019 2:33 pm, George Herold wrote:
Quote:
Hi all, A (mostly clueless) physics type wants to do some RF stuff. (measuring nmr signals.. protons, ~5-25 MHz range) He's got something
working, but construction is ugly. I was thinking of recommending an ARRL handbook, is any version better than others?


I learnt a lot from the 1970 ARRL handbook - can't speak on later issues.

Probably of more use for your colleague might be one of the books by Wes
Hayward, like "Experimental Methods for RF Design" (quoting title from
memory so could be slightly wrong).

Although not RF specific AoE is, of course, also obligatory reading :)

piglet

George Herold
Guest

Thu Feb 07, 2019 5:45 pm   



On Thursday, February 7, 2019 at 9:45:12 AM UTC-5, Phil Hobbs wrote:
Quote:
On 2/7/19 9:33 AM, George Herold wrote:
Hi all, A (mostly clueless) physics type wants to do some RF stuff. (measuring nmr signals.. protons, ~5-25 MHz range) He's got something
working, but construction is ugly. I was thinking of recommending an ARRL handbook, is any version better than others?


IIRC they took out a lot of the construction project stuff in the early
'90s.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs
OK Thanks Phil. I've got the 1992 version and the 1998.


1992 has 11 chapters under Construction and Maintenance
1998 has only 4, but there is a whole bunch under the title of
Practical Design Projects.

George H.
Quote:

--
Dr Philip C D Hobbs
Principal Consultant
ElectroOptical Innovations LLC / Hobbs ElectroOptics
Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics
Briarcliff Manor NY 10510

http://electrooptical.net
http://hobbs-eo.com


Don Kuenz
Guest

Thu Feb 07, 2019 5:45 pm   



piglet <erichpwagner_at_hotmail.com> wrote:
Quote:
On 07/02/2019 2:33 pm, George Herold wrote:
Hi all, A (mostly clueless) physics type wants to do some RF stuff.
(measuring nmr signals.. protons, ~5-25 MHz range) He's got something
working, but construction is ugly. I was thinking of recommending an
ARRL handbook, is any version better than others?


I learnt a lot from the 1970 ARRL handbook - can't speak on later issues.

Probably of more use for your colleague might be one of the books by Wes
Hayward, like "Experimental Methods for RF Design" (quoting title from
memory so could be slightly wrong).

Although not RF specific AoE is, of course, also obligatory reading Smile


The _1986 Handbook_ is my oldest and the _2018 Handbook_ is my newest.
The _2019 Handbook_'s apparently too wide for a single book, so ARRL
made it a boxed set of six books.
To answer George's question, newer's better. All four of my
handbooks, from 1986 to 2018, contain a chapter on construction
techniques. Among other things, the 2018 book replaces two pages of
photosensitive copper-clad board paraphernalia content with a single
paragraph that advocates on-line PCB board fabrication.
In areas other than construction techniques, the _1986 Handbook_'s
"Power Supplies" chapter only talks about transformer conversion with
linear regulators. The _2018 Handbook_'s "Power Sources" chapter
includes 1986 content and it adds an additional ten and a half pages
about Switch Mode and high-voltage techniques.

Thank you, 73,

--
Don Kuenz KB7RPU
There was a young lady named Bright Whose speed was far faster than light;
She set out one day In a relative way And returned on the previous night.

John Larkin
Guest

Thu Feb 07, 2019 10:45 pm   



On Thu, 7 Feb 2019 06:33:34 -0800 (PST), George Herold
<gherold_at_teachspin.com> wrote:

Quote:
Hi all, A (mostly clueless) physics type wants to do some RF stuff. (measuring nmr signals.. protons, ~5-25 MHz range) He's got something
working, but construction is ugly. I was thinking of recommending an ARRL handbook, is any version better than others?


I used to do a lot of NMR stuff, but mostly current controllers and
pulsed gradient drivers and temperature controllers. Let me know if I
can help there. I don't do much classic (sinewave, tuned circuit) RF.

My customers would use an ARB to push a reverse-FFT bandlimited
current waveform into the RF coil, over some frequency range of
interest, then listen and FFT.


--

John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc
picosecond timing precision measurement

jlarkin att highlandtechnology dott com
http://www.highlandtechnology.com

dcaster@krl.org
Guest

Thu Feb 07, 2019 10:45 pm   



On Thursday, February 7, 2019 at 9:33:41 AM UTC-5, George Herold wrote:
Quote:
Hi all, A (mostly clueless) physics type wants to do some RF stuff. (measuring nmr signals.. protons, ~5-25 MHz range) He's got something
working, but construction is ugly. I was thinking of recommending an ARRL handbook, is any version better than others?


You might search on Ebay and AliExpress for prototype pcbs. THere are some with multiple holes per pad that might be of some help. Try searching on
Aliexpress for TMOEC pcb.

Dan

John Larkin
Guest

Thu Feb 07, 2019 10:45 pm   



On Thu, 7 Feb 2019 13:29:42 -0800 (PST), "dcaster_at_krl.org"
<dcaster_at_krl.org> wrote:

Quote:
On Thursday, February 7, 2019 at 9:33:41 AM UTC-5, George Herold wrote:
Hi all, A (mostly clueless) physics type wants to do some RF stuff. (measuring nmr signals.. protons, ~5-25 MHz range) He's got something
working, but construction is ugly. I was thinking of recommending an ARRL handbook, is any version better than others?

You might search on Ebay and AliExpress for prototype pcbs. THere are some with multiple holes per pad that might be of some help. Try searching on
Aliexpress for TMOEC pcb.

Dan


Dremel!

https://www.dropbox.com/s/7bihbjbaojvta0z/Z382_1.JPG?dl=0



--

John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc
picosecond timing precision measurement

jlarkin att highlandtechnology dott com
http://www.highlandtechnology.com

Phil Hobbs
Guest

Thu Feb 07, 2019 10:45 pm   



On 2/7/19 11:04 AM, Don Kuenz wrote:
Quote:
piglet <erichpwagner_at_hotmail.com> wrote:
On 07/02/2019 2:33 pm, George Herold wrote:
Hi all, A (mostly clueless) physics type wants to do some RF stuff.
(measuring nmr signals.. protons, ~5-25 MHz range) He's got something
working, but construction is ugly. I was thinking of recommending an
ARRL handbook, is any version better than others?


I learnt a lot from the 1970 ARRL handbook - can't speak on later issues.

Probably of more use for your colleague might be one of the books by Wes
Hayward, like "Experimental Methods for RF Design" (quoting title from
memory so could be slightly wrong).

Although not RF specific AoE is, of course, also obligatory reading :)

The _1986 Handbook_ is my oldest and the _2018 Handbook_ is my newest.
The _2019 Handbook_'s apparently too wide for a single book, so ARRL
made it a boxed set of six books.
To answer George's question, newer's better. All four of my
handbooks, from 1986 to 2018, contain a chapter on construction
techniques. Among other things, the 2018 book replaces two pages of
photosensitive copper-clad board paraphernalia content with a single
paragraph that advocates on-line PCB board fabrication.
In areas other than construction techniques, the _1986 Handbook_'s
"Power Supplies" chapter only talks about transformer conversion with
linear regulators. The _2018 Handbook_'s "Power Sources" chapter
includes 1986 content and it adds an additional ten and a half pages
about Switch Mode and high-voltage techniques.

Thank you, 73,

Okay, I bought a softcover 2019 book to supplement my '66, '76, and '92
ones. It'll be interesting to see how it's changed.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

--
Dr Philip C D Hobbs
Principal Consultant
ElectroOptical Innovations LLC / Hobbs ElectroOptics
Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics
Briarcliff Manor NY 10510

http://electrooptical.net
https://hobbs-eo.com


Guest

Thu Feb 07, 2019 10:45 pm   



George Herold <gherold_at_teachspin.com> wrote in
news:ca78db38-167a-4ff8-af93-7bfbbbf5dafe_at_googlegroups.com:

Quote:
Hi all, A (mostly clueless) physics type wants to do some RF
stuff. (measuring nmr signals.. protons, ~5-25 MHz range) He's
got something working, but construction is ugly. I was thinking
of recommending an ARRL handbook, is any version better than
others?



Jus use google images. After seeing what you like, click and peruse
further.

Like search for matching transformer or balun, etc.

Narrow search by specifying the type of balun you want. Lots of
folks out there made theirs and post images and even characterization
data sometimes.

Google images rocks!

Don Kuenz
Guest

Thu Feb 07, 2019 11:45 pm   



Phil Hobbs <pcdhSpamMeSenseless_at_electrooptical.net> wrote:
Quote:
On 2/7/19 11:04 AM, Don Kuenz wrote:
piglet <erichpwagner_at_hotmail.com> wrote:
On 07/02/2019 2:33 pm, George Herold wrote:
Hi all, A (mostly clueless) physics type wants to do some RF stuff.
(measuring nmr signals.. protons, ~5-25 MHz range) He's got something
working, but construction is ugly. I was thinking of recommending an
ARRL handbook, is any version better than others?


I learnt a lot from the 1970 ARRL handbook - can't speak on later issues.

Probably of more use for your colleague might be one of the books by Wes
Hayward, like "Experimental Methods for RF Design" (quoting title from
memory so could be slightly wrong).

Although not RF specific AoE is, of course, also obligatory reading :)

The _1986 Handbook_ is my oldest and the _2018 Handbook_ is my newest.
The _2019 Handbook_'s apparently too wide for a single book, so ARRL
made it a boxed set of six books.
To answer George's question, newer's better. All four of my
handbooks, from 1986 to 2018, contain a chapter on construction
techniques. Among other things, the 2018 book replaces two pages of
photosensitive copper-clad board paraphernalia content with a single
paragraph that advocates on-line PCB board fabrication.
In areas other than construction techniques, the _1986 Handbook_'s
"Power Supplies" chapter only talks about transformer conversion with
linear regulators. The _2018 Handbook_'s "Power Sources" chapter
includes 1986 content and it adds an additional ten and a half pages
about Switch Mode and high-voltage techniques.

Okay, I bought a softcover 2019 book to supplement my '66, '76, and '92
ones. It'll be interesting to see how it's changed.


Although it's extremely tempting to buy the 2019 book, my resolution is
to at least work my way through the 2018 book first.
A new chapter on Computer-Aided Circuit Design appeared sometime
between the 2006 book and the 2018 book. Some of the topics in the new
chapter are identical to SED threads from the past few years:

* Hobby versus Professional
* Monte Carlo analysis
* Gummel-Poon model
* IMD Simulators
* Harmonic Balance Simulators
* Maxwell Without Tears
* Surface Meshing-Method of Moments


OK. Although the new print chapter covers Maxwell the "With Tears" QEX
reprint is actually in the downloadable eBook, which comes bundled with
the book. Sometime between 2006 and 2018 ARRL stopped bundling physical
media with the book.

Thank you, 73,

--
Don Kuenz KB7RPU
There was a young lady named Bright Whose speed was far faster than light;
She set out one day In a relative way And returned on the previous night.


Guest

Fri Feb 08, 2019 2:45 am   



On Friday, February 8, 2019 at 1:33:41 AM UTC+11, George Herold wrote:
Quote:
Hi all, A (mostly clueless) physics type wants to do some RF stuff. (measuring nmr signals.. protons, ~5-25 MHz range) He's got something
working, but construction is ugly. I was thinking of recommending an ARRL handbook, is any version better than others?


My own inclination would be to concentrate on building a circuit on (and as much as possible in) a multilayer board, with all the fast connections realised as controlled impedance microstrip or (better) buried striplines.

This is not traditional RF construction, and stuff with history (like the ARRL handbook) may not go in for it as the defaukt approach.

One of the responses does point out that the latest copy of the ARRL handbook talks in terms of getting printed circuit board made on-line, and KiCad lets you do the layout and create the Gerber files you'd need for that for free, not that the process isn't time consuming (but that's unavoidable).

--
Bill Sloman, Sydney

Jeff Liebermann
Guest

Fri Feb 08, 2019 2:45 am   



On Thu, 7 Feb 2019 06:33:34 -0800 (PST), George Herold
<gherold_at_teachspin.com> wrote:

Quote:
Hi all, A (mostly clueless) physics type wants to do
some RF stuff. (measuring nmr signals.. protons,
~5-25 MHz range) He's got something working, but
construction is ugly.


The uglier the antenna, construction, or layout, the better it works.
<https://hackadaycom.files.wordpress.com/2016/05/williams-workbench.jpg>
<http://hephaestusaudio.com/media/2009/05/bob-pease-breadboard.jpg>

Quote:
I was thinking of recommending an ARRL handbook, is
any version better than others?


I don't know. I have some old ARRL Handbook issues at home that I
rarely read or use.

5-25 MHz is practically DC as far as breadboarding is concerned. As
long as the design isn't extreme in some manner (very high gain, low
noise figure, high power, very low power supply voltages, etc), then
fairly sloppy construction methods will suffice. The problem is that
nobody writes articles or books explaining how to build a sloppy or
messy 3D prototype.

There are lots of breadboarding methods available. I rather like John
Larkin's method of using PCB islands glued or soldered to a Cu clad
PCB. The problem is that I've only built two such breadboards. The
way I normally do it is with a single sided Cu clad 0.062 PCB. The
copper is the common ground. The components that have one or more
grounded leads are soldered directly to the ground. I use small value
ceramic caps as standoffs, with the ungrounded lead pointing up and
away from the ground plane. Active parts are connected between these
proxy standoffs to form a 3D circuit. I like this method because the
huge ground plane provides really good bypass capacitor grounding and
device isolation, which keeps the various gain stages from becoming
oscillatory. If I keep the leads short, there's a little ringing and
little tendency for the leads to radiate. If you look carefully at
the above photos, the breadboards are build in somewhat the same
manner.

Normally, I would also post a photo, but I don't have any such
prototypes in my palatial office. Maybe when (or if) I go home
tonite[1].


[1] The water company called to inform me that I'll need to boil my
water for the next 48 hrs because their redwood tank ran dry and
sucked up the crud from the bottom of the tank.

--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl_at_cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

sdy
Guest

Fri Feb 08, 2019 2:45 am   



On Thursday, February 7, 2019 at 9:33:41 AM UTC-5, George Herold wrote:
Quote:
Hi all, A (mostly clueless) physics type wants to do some RF stuff. (measuring nmr signals.. protons, ~5-25 MHz range) He's got something
working, but construction is ugly. I was thinking of recommending an ARRL handbook, is any version better than others?


Best I ever had for building, not just RF:
Building Scientific Apparatus: A Practical Guide To Design And Construction,

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Building-Scientific-Apparatus-A-Practical-Guide-To-Design-And-Construction/202578236540?epid=82888&hash=item2f2a9a947c:g:wSkAAOSwEHhaqsdZ:rk:4:pf:1&frcectupt=true

Or late 70s-early 80s ARRL are real good RF.


Guest

Fri Feb 08, 2019 9:45 am   



John Larkin
Quote:


I No lOnGeR BeliEve iN pCbS
TV:
http://panteltje.com/panteltje/scope_tv/circuit_haystack2.jpg

1.5 GHz ATV modulator:
http://panteltje.com/panteltjhttp://panteltje.com/pub/H501S_remote_with_autopilot_HUD_flight_recorder_IMG_6742.JPGe/raspberry_pi_dvb-s_transmitter/raspberry_pi_datv_transmitter_test_setup_IMG_3937.JPG

Auto-pilot, HUD, Flight recorder
http://panteltje.com/pub/H501S_flight_recorder_IMG_6733.JPG
the empty space has a SDcard holder hidden under it.
http://panteltje.com/pub/H501S_remote_with_autopilot_HUD_flight_recorder_IMG_6742.JPG

double sided tape


peeseebees only make sense for mass production.
Working this way is much faster, more reliable, easier to change and update, and cheaper.
peeseebees is a religion, supported by peeseebee software sellers.
All fanatics that want the end of this uniqueverse.

http://panteltje.com/pub/2.4_GHz_to_1.5_GHz_down_converter_closeup_IMG_4660.JPG

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