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OT: Are desktop 3-D printers ready for prime time?

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Guest

Sat Apr 25, 2020 1:45 am   



John Doe <always.look_at_message.header> wrote in
news:r7vhja$e1v$1_at_dont-email.me:

Quote:
Seems the affordable 3-D printers are all made in China, but the
ASA filament (UV resistant, outdoors use) is made by at least two
different companies in the USA... FilamentOne and 3DXMAX.


Go straight to the industrial level and get a made in the USA 3-D
METAL printing CNC workstation like GE and Boeing uses. Get the big
restart contracts.

Might have to take out a loan for that one though.

Jasen Betts
Guest

Sat Apr 25, 2020 3:40 am   



On 2020-04-23, Ricky C <gnuarm.deletethisbit_at_gmail.com> wrote:
Quote:
On Thursday, April 23, 2020 at 7:03:39 AM UTC-4, Lasse Langwadt Christensen wrote:
torsdag den 23. april 2020 kl. 12.35.22 UTC+2 skrev Ricky C:
On Thursday, April 23, 2020 at 4:51:08 AM UTC-4, TTman wrote:
On 23/04/2020 06:03, boB wrote:
On Wed, 22 Apr 2020 21:45:12 -0700 (PDT), Ricky C
gnuarm.deletethisbit_at_gmail.com> wrote:

On Wednesday, April 22, 2020 at 7:40:21 PM UTC-4, John Doe wrote:
Seems many 3-D printers in the $500-$750 (US) range can do ABS plastic
now. Or not?

Thanks.

What would you like to make with a 3D printer? I've considered having one, but I think it would sit 99.9% of the time. Kinda like having my own PCB assembly equipment.

Doesn't one of the shipping store companies have 3D printers for use now or did that not pan out? It sounded like a good idea, but I recall they charged by the time or weight of material and could not give you a price until it was done.


Some of the Maker places have these you can use. They're closed now
though I'd bet

Our company has had a few 3D printers over the years and they have
paid for theselves many times over I think.

I know that if I had one at home I would not get much else done.
Same would be if I had a drone so I guess I will just wait a while.

$500 is pretty cheap !


The UK is awash with people/schools/ etc. making face splash guards..
One guy on the Isle of Wight has made over 1000, materials being
crowdfunded.

I can't figure out how a 3D printer helps make splash guards. A kayak factory in Kentucky (Lightning I think) is making face guards. They are a flexible band with a sponge foam block attached at pivot points to a clear plastic sheet. What part of that can be printed? Seems like it is all pretty simple to make by standard means and a whole lot more cost effective and in much higher volumes.


this is one design, https://youtu.be/7tQUZfVYfbE

the shield itself I think is transparencies normally used for overhead projectors

I suppose the pink parts are 3D printed?

Yeah, that shield seemed like it was much thicker than a transparency foil and can you still buy those???


Clear plastic sheet is used for covers on some comb-bound documents.
https://www.warehousestationery.co.nz/product/W2215216.html#q=BINDING&start=1

> Who has overhead projectors???

I could sell you one.

I was thinking of putting a laptop LCD (with the backlight removed) on the image stage and
making a video projector. but it would probably cost more to run than
it's worth. (projector lamps are expensive)

the OHP foils I have here are 100 microns (ish) so the above covers at
150 are slightly thicker and about twice as stiff.

--
Jasen.

John Doe
Guest

Sat Apr 25, 2020 4:45 am   



"Tom Del Rosso" <fizzbintuesday_at_that-google-mail-domain.com> wrote:

Quote:
Jasen Betts wrote:
John Doe wrote:

Seems many 3-D printers in the $500-$750 (US) range can do ABS
plastic now. Or not?

For ABS you need a heated bed, and the head needs to be able run
slightly hotter vs PLA. It's a faily common capability or a
cheap upgrade.

And tips from youtube say that ABS warps during printing if there
are slight air currents, so you have to enclose the print area.


Yes. Nearly everybody says it's better. Even open units have covers.

The warping thing, or just trying to make a decent part, is interesting.
People are all over the place on that stuff.

https://youtu.be/Xa5PxP5H9_E?t=909

He claims to have easily made some ABS parts, but who knows.
I would go with ASA (acrylonitrile styrene acrylate) since it's UV
resistant. It's made by at least two companies in the USA (FilamentOne
and 3DXMAX). Need to find some experience with that (two measly reviews
on Amazon). Trying to find real information while the overlords keep
pushing me back into a box.

Ricky C
Guest

Sat Apr 25, 2020 4:45 am   



On Friday, April 24, 2020 at 10:02:46 PM UTC-4, Jasen Betts wrote:
Quote:
On 2020-04-23, Ricky C <gnuarm.deletethisbit_at_gmail.com> wrote:

Yeah, that shield seemed like it was much thicker than a transparency foil and can you still buy those???

Clear plastic sheet is used for covers on some comb-bound documents.
https://www.warehousestationery.co.nz/product/W2215216.html#q=BINDING&start=1

Who has overhead projectors???

I could sell you one.


That's ok thanks. I already have some space heaters to blow out my fuses if I need it.


Quote:
I was thinking of putting a laptop LCD (with the backlight removed) on the image stage and
making a video projector. but it would probably cost more to run than
it's worth. (projector lamps are expensive)


Heat might be an issue. That was the TI DLP thing basically right? Or the big screen TV thing they used football players to market. Those were just TV picture tubes with lenses that projected onto a screen... very dimly.

--

Rick C.

--+ Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
--+ Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209

Jasen Betts
Guest

Sat Apr 25, 2020 6:45 am   



On 2020-04-25, Ricky C <gnuarm.deletethisbit_at_gmail.com> wrote:
Quote:
On Friday, April 24, 2020 at 10:02:46 PM UTC-4, Jasen Betts wrote:
On 2020-04-23, Ricky C <gnuarm.deletethisbit_at_gmail.com> wrote:

Yeah, that shield seemed like it was much thicker than a transparency foil and can you still buy those???

Clear plastic sheet is used for covers on some comb-bound documents.
https://www.warehousestationery.co.nz/product/W2215216.html#q=BINDING&start=1

Who has overhead projectors???

I could sell you one.

That's ok thanks. I already have some space heaters to blow out my fuses if I need it.

I was thinking of putting a laptop LCD (with the backlight removed) on the image stage and
making a video projector. but it would probably cost more to run than
it's worth. (projector lamps are expensive)

Heat might be an issue. That was the TI DLP thing basically right?


DLP is micromirrors, optically like a solid-state vesion of the old Ediophor system.

Quote:
Or the big screen TV thing they used football players to market.
Those were just TV picture tubes with lenses that projected onto a screen... very dimly.


They used separate tubes for red green and blue so that eliminated energy
wasted sending current to the shadow mask, and the tubes had big
heatsinks.

trasmissive LCD projectors are different technology. many also use
separate red green and blue sources and combine them using dichroic
mirrors embedded in a glass block. some others used squential colour
filters.






--
Jasen.

John Doe
Guest

Fri May 01, 2020 1:45 am   



Ordered one. Can't wait!
Will be using ASA filament.
I have had zillions of uses for such a thing over the last many decades.
Unfortunately it was a bit before my time.

Dying to find out if strong parts can be made. Lots of people talk about
that, but there is no way to know without actually trying. Either that,
or the people who talk about it just don't give enough information.

For example... Can you make a spacer out of it, and how much crushing
force will it withstand. Will see!

Ricky C
Guest

Fri May 01, 2020 2:45 am   



On Thursday, April 30, 2020 at 8:36:35 PM UTC-4, John Doe wrote:
Quote:
Ordered one. Can't wait!
Will be using ASA filament.
I have had zillions of uses for such a thing over the last many decades.
Unfortunately it was a bit before my time.

Dying to find out if strong parts can be made. Lots of people talk about
that, but there is no way to know without actually trying. Either that,
or the people who talk about it just don't give enough information.

For example... Can you make a spacer out of it, and how much crushing
force will it withstand. Will see!


What are you planning on spacing with them? Circuit boards or Buicks?

--

Rick C.

-+- Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
-+- Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209


Guest

Fri May 01, 2020 2:45 am   



Ricky C <gnuarm.deletethisbit_at_gmail.com> wrote in
news:2404ecc2-2b02-47a8-b75f-632f62d631c3_at_googlegroups.com:

Quote:
On Thursday, April 30, 2020 at 8:36:35 PM UTC-4, John Doe wrote:
Ordered one. Can't wait!
Will be using ASA filament.
I have had zillions of uses for such a thing over the last many
decades. Unfortunately it was a bit before my time.

Dying to find out if strong parts can be made. Lots of people
talk about that, but there is no way to know without actually
trying. Either that, or the people who talk about it just don't
give enough information.

For example... Can you make a spacer out of it, and how much
crushing force will it withstand. Will see!

What are you planning on spacing with them? Circuit boards or
Buicks?


Tiger tanks.


Guest

Fri May 01, 2020 2:45 am   



On Thursday, April 30, 2020 at 5:36:35 PM UTC-7, John Doe wrote:
Quote:
Ordered one. Can't wait!
Will be using ASA filament.
I have had zillions of uses for such a thing over the last many decades.
Unfortunately it was a bit before my time.

Dying to find out if strong parts can be made. Lots of people talk about
that, but there is no way to know without actually trying. Either that,
or the people who talk about it just don't give enough information.

For example... Can you make a spacer out of it, and how much crushing
force will it withstand. Will see!


Well, it depends on the software. The software tends to save materials on the inside layer; so there are more air gaps inside. However, you can tell it to use more materials, less air gaps, and stronger parts.

Regarding crushing force, i would compare it to wood, but not steel.


Guest

Fri May 01, 2020 2:45 am   



John Doe <always.look_at_message.header> wrote in
news:r8fque$6ou$1_at_dont-email.me:

Quote:
Ordered one. Can't wait!
Will be using ASA filament.
I have had zillions of uses for such a thing over the last many
decades. Unfortunately it was a bit before my time.

Dying to find out if strong parts can be made. Lots of people talk
about that, but there is no way to know without actually trying.
Either that, or the people who talk about it just don't give
enough information.

For example... Can you make a spacer out of it, and how much
crushing force will it withstand. Will see!


Well, it sounds like what you really mean is a thrust washer.

That will depend on that surface quality of the two surfaces it
will be doing the "washing" for. The surface and the material will
determine the coefficient of friction. It will also matter how much
rotating use it gets while it is "bearing" against the forces it is
sandwiched between.

You would be far better off gettinf sheet stock and cutting out a
washer.

If you refer to a "stanchion", then a lot of factors "weigh" in to
it.

John Doe
Guest

Fri May 01, 2020 3:45 am   



I said "spacer", not "washer".
Anybody who makes random stuff knows better.
You need ALL different sizes (and shapes) of materials that cannot be
easily made from ordinary stock. I sometimes end up having to think
about all the things I have ever seen in stores, trying hard to recall
something that might match my purpose.



DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno_at_decadence.org wrote:

Quote:
John Doe <always.look_at_message.header> wrote in
news:r8fque$6ou$1_at_dont-email.me:

Ordered one. Can't wait!
Will be using ASA filament.
I have had zillions of uses for such a thing over the last many
decades. Unfortunately it was a bit before my time.

Dying to find out if strong parts can be made. Lots of people talk
about that, but there is no way to know without actually trying.
Either that, or the people who talk about it just don't give
enough information.

For example... Can you make a spacer out of it, and how much
crushing force will it withstand. Will see!


Well, it sounds like what you really mean is a thrust washer.

That will depend on that surface quality of the two surfaces it
will be doing the "washing" for. The surface and the material will
determine the coefficient of friction. It will also matter how much
rotating use it gets while it is "bearing" against the forces it is
sandwiched between.

You would be far better off gettinf sheet stock and cutting out a
washer.

If you refer to a "stanchion", then a lot of factors "weigh" in to
it.


John Doe
Guest

Fri May 01, 2020 3:45 am   



edward.ming.lee_at_gmail.com wrote:

Quote:
John Doe wrote:

Ordered one. Can't wait! Will be using ASA filament. I have had
zillions of uses for such a thing over the last many decades.
Unfortunately it was a bit [after] my time.

Dying to find out if strong parts can be made. Lots of people
talk about that, but there is no way to know without actually
trying. Either that, or the people who talk about it just don't
give enough information.

For example... Can you make a spacer out of it, and how much
crushing force will it withstand. Will see!

Well, it depends on the software. The software tends to save
materials on the inside layer; so there are more air gaps inside.
However, you can tell it to use more materials, less air gaps, and
stronger parts.

Regarding crushing force, i would compare it to wood, but not
steel.


That doesn't say what sort of filament. Seems nobody knows or nobody
cares to describe it well enough. But doesn't matter now!

Maybe more skillful searching to find people who use the most durable
(or least frail) filaments for mechanical parts would have helped.


Guest

Fri May 01, 2020 4:45 am   



John Doe <always.look_at_message.header> wrote in
news:r8g0o2$1s0$2_at_dont-email.me:

> I said "spacer", not "washer".

OK. I said washer not spacer.

> Anybody who makes random stuff knows better.

What I said was home made random stuff. :-)

Quote:
You need ALL different sizes (and shapes) of materials that cannot
be easily made from ordinary stock. I sometimes end up having to
think about all the things I have ever seen in stores, trying hard
to recall something that might match my purpose.


I would still have called it a stanchion. Then you can randomly
test it for crush strength... at random moments.

Use GrabCAD and get great ideas from others' works, which many of
them were inspired by yet others.

<https://grabcad.com/library>

<https://grabcad.com/library/portable-papr-powered-air-purifying-
respirator-1>

<https://grabcad.com/library/ventilation-covid-19-1>

Ricky C
Guest

Fri May 01, 2020 5:45 am   



On Thursday, April 30, 2020 at 10:24:00 PM UTC-4, John Doe wrote:
Quote:
edward.ming.lee_at_gmail.com wrote:

John Doe wrote:

Ordered one. Can't wait! Will be using ASA filament. I have had
zillions of uses for such a thing over the last many decades.
Unfortunately it was a bit [after] my time.

Dying to find out if strong parts can be made. Lots of people
talk about that, but there is no way to know without actually
trying. Either that, or the people who talk about it just don't
give enough information.

For example... Can you make a spacer out of it, and how much
crushing force will it withstand. Will see!

Well, it depends on the software. The software tends to save
materials on the inside layer; so there are more air gaps inside.
However, you can tell it to use more materials, less air gaps, and
stronger parts.

Regarding crushing force, i would compare it to wood, but not
steel.

That doesn't say what sort of filament. Seems nobody knows or nobody
cares to describe it well enough. But doesn't matter now!

Maybe more skillful searching to find people who use the most durable
(or least frail) filaments for mechanical parts would have helped.


I have made things I needed from plastic, wood or metal. I have yet to find a need for something that would best be made on a 3D printer. I believe they are mostly used for making early prototypes of items that will ultimately be made by other means. It is still the exception for them to be used to make production items although there is potentially a niche market for items that are too pricey to make other ways but too low volume for mass production.

I see there are online services to make items by 3d printing just as you can have PCBs made. Why make your own when you can get better quality at a lower cost from a service?

https://www.sculpteo.com/en/?icid=3DPRINTING:XLPB::SERVICES::LEARN

This is one of many. I notice that many service companies offer many other manufacturing services as well.

--

Rick C.

-++ Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
-++ Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209

John Doe
Guest

Fri May 01, 2020 6:45 am   



Obviously my interest is not "production items".
Anecdotes and lack of experience with making things
is not an argument.

It shouldn't post while under the influence of drugs...

--
Ricky C <gnuarm.deletethisbit_at_gmail.com> wrote:

Quote:
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Subject: Re: OT: Are desktop 3-D printers ready for prime time?
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On Thursday, April 30, 2020 at 10:24:00 PM UTC-4, John Doe wrote:
edward.ming.lee_at_gmail.com wrote:

John Doe wrote:

Ordered one. Can't wait! Will be using ASA filament. I have had
zillions of uses for such a thing over the last many decades.
Unfortunately it was a bit [after] my time.

Dying to find out if strong parts can be made. Lots of people
talk about that, but there is no way to know without actually
trying. Either that, or the people who talk about it just don't
give enough information.

For example... Can you make a spacer out of it, and how much
crushing force will it withstand. Will see!

Well, it depends on the software. The software tends to save
materials on the inside layer; so there are more air gaps inside.
However, you can tell it to use more materials, less air gaps, and
stronger parts.

Regarding crushing force, i would compare it to wood, but not
steel.

That doesn't say what sort of filament. Seems nobody knows or nobody
cares to describe it well enough. But doesn't matter now!

Maybe more skillful searching to find people who use the most durable
(or least frail) filaments for mechanical parts would have helped.

I have made things I needed from plastic, wood or metal. I have yet to find a need for something that would best be made on a 3D printer. I believe they are mostly used for making early prototypes of items that will ultimately be made by other means. It is still the exception for them to be used to make production items although there is potentially a niche market for items that are too pricey to make other ways but too low volume for mass production.

I see there are online services to make items by 3d printing just as you can have PCBs made. Why make your own when you can get better quality at a lower cost from a service?

https://www.sculpteo.com/en/?icid=3DPRINTING:XLPB::SERVICES::LEARN

This is one of many. I notice that many service companies offer many other manufacturing services as well.

--

Rick C.

-++ Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
-++ Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209



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