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Martin Riddle
Guest

Tue Feb 05, 2019 4:45 am   



On Mon, 04 Feb 2019 07:31:08 -0800, John Larkin
<jjlarkin_at_highlandtechnology.com> wrote:

Quote:
On Mon, 4 Feb 2019 09:40:14 -0500, bitrex <user_at_example.net> wrote:

On 02/04/2019 09:17 AM, gnuarm.deletethisbit_at_gmail.com wrote:
On Monday, February 4, 2019 at 9:08:33 AM UTC-5, Cursitor Doom wrote:
Those batteries just aren't up to it.

No, in the winter they get down! I'll be sure to check on this when I take my next 1500 mile trip. lol


The comments on ZeroHedge are usually worth a laugh though, they're
always from the usual type of comments-dude, who posts on ZeroHedge all
day AND claims to get all the hottest chicks

Is the Fortune article polluted because it's linked from Zero?

Do Teslas run just as well below 0F?


The internal battery heaters are about 1500kw. So with out a super
charger your dead in the water.

Cheers


Guest

Tue Feb 05, 2019 5:45 am   



On Monday, February 4, 2019 at 9:53:36 PM UTC-5, Martin Riddle wrote:
Quote:
On Mon, 04 Feb 2019 07:31:08 -0800, John Larkin
jjlarkin_at_highlandtechnology.com> wrote:

On Mon, 4 Feb 2019 09:40:14 -0500, bitrex <user_at_example.net> wrote:

On 02/04/2019 09:17 AM, gnuarm.deletethisbit_at_gmail.com wrote:
On Monday, February 4, 2019 at 9:08:33 AM UTC-5, Cursitor Doom wrote:
Those batteries just aren't up to it.

No, in the winter they get down! I'll be sure to check on this when I take my next 1500 mile trip. lol


The comments on ZeroHedge are usually worth a laugh though, they're
always from the usual type of comments-dude, who posts on ZeroHedge all
day AND claims to get all the hottest chicks

Is the Fortune article polluted because it's linked from Zero?

Do Teslas run just as well below 0F?

The internal battery heaters are about 1500kw. So with out a super
charger your dead in the water.


I happen to be near a couple of nuclear power generators, but I don't think they want me using such a large percentage of their supply. You said the battery heaters use 1.5 MW. If you meant 1.5 kW then I can supply that from a 120 volt outlet.

Either way you would seem to be wrong. The battery heater in my car is around 5 kW and can be supplied by a 240 volt connection. In fact, Tesla provides a mode where the battery is preheated through that connection so you start your morning commute with a car that not only has a warm cabin, but a warm battery. Smile


Rick C.

+- Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209


Guest

Tue Feb 05, 2019 5:45 am   



On Tuesday, February 5, 2019 at 2:31:15 AM UTC+11, John Larkin wrote:
Quote:
On Mon, 4 Feb 2019 09:40:14 -0500, bitrex <user_at_example.net> wrote:

On 02/04/2019 09:17 AM, gnuarm.deletethisbit_at_gmail.com wrote:
On Monday, February 4, 2019 at 9:08:33 AM UTC-5, Cursitor Doom wrote:
Those batteries just aren't up to it.

No, in the winter they get down! I'll be sure to check on this when I take my next 1500 mile trip. lol


The comments on ZeroHedge are usually worth a laugh though, they're
always from the usual type of comments-dude, who posts on ZeroHedge all
day AND claims to get all the hottest chicks

Is the Fortune article polluted because it's linked from Zero?


Obviously. It's a ZeroHedge item that has been pirated by Fortune.

> Do Teslas run just as well below 0F?

Do regular gasoline powered cars run just as well below 0F?

Diesels can have the fuel get too gummy to get through to the engine, and not having enough anti-freeze in your radiator water can have unfortunate side-effects too.

--
Bill Sloman, Sydney

bitrex
Guest

Tue Feb 05, 2019 7:45 am   



On 02/04/2019 11:19 PM, bill.sloman_at_ieee.org wrote:
Quote:
On Tuesday, February 5, 2019 at 2:31:15 AM UTC+11, John Larkin wrote:
On Mon, 4 Feb 2019 09:40:14 -0500, bitrex <user_at_example.net> wrote:

On 02/04/2019 09:17 AM, gnuarm.deletethisbit_at_gmail.com wrote:
On Monday, February 4, 2019 at 9:08:33 AM UTC-5, Cursitor Doom wrote:
Those batteries just aren't up to it.

No, in the winter they get down! I'll be sure to check on this when I take my next 1500 mile trip. lol


The comments on ZeroHedge are usually worth a laugh though, they're
always from the usual type of comments-dude, who posts on ZeroHedge all
day AND claims to get all the hottest chicks

Is the Fortune article polluted because it's linked from Zero?

Obviously. It's a ZeroHedge item that has been pirated by Fortune.

Do Teslas run just as well below 0F?

Do regular gasoline powered cars run just as well below 0F?

Diesels can have the fuel get too gummy to get through to the engine, and not having enough anti-freeze in your radiator water can have unfortunate side-effects too.


Elon Musk tends to over-promise and under-deliver. In honesty this is a
perfect fit for American consumer psychology and what Americans tend to
expect and are conditioned to.

Under-promising and over-delivering gets you not very much cred here and
sometimes works against you, buyers/clients think you aren't confident
enough. They'll go with someone else who believes wholeheartedly in
their less-than-exceptional product.


Guest

Tue Feb 05, 2019 7:45 am   



On Tuesday, February 5, 2019 at 1:11:10 AM UTC-5, bitrex wrote:
Quote:
On 02/04/2019 11:19 PM, bill.sloman_at_ieee.org wrote:
On Tuesday, February 5, 2019 at 2:31:15 AM UTC+11, John Larkin wrote:
On Mon, 4 Feb 2019 09:40:14 -0500, bitrex <user_at_example.net> wrote:

On 02/04/2019 09:17 AM, gnuarm.deletethisbit_at_gmail.com wrote:
On Monday, February 4, 2019 at 9:08:33 AM UTC-5, Cursitor Doom wrote:
Those batteries just aren't up to it.

No, in the winter they get down! I'll be sure to check on this when I take my next 1500 mile trip. lol


The comments on ZeroHedge are usually worth a laugh though, they're
always from the usual type of comments-dude, who posts on ZeroHedge all
day AND claims to get all the hottest chicks

Is the Fortune article polluted because it's linked from Zero?

Obviously. It's a ZeroHedge item that has been pirated by Fortune.

Do Teslas run just as well below 0F?

Do regular gasoline powered cars run just as well below 0F?

Diesels can have the fuel get too gummy to get through to the engine, and not having enough anti-freeze in your radiator water can have unfortunate side-effects too.


Elon Musk tends to over-promise and under-deliver. In honesty this is a
perfect fit for American consumer psychology and what Americans tend to
expect and are conditioned to.

Under-promising and over-delivering gets you not very much cred here and
sometimes works against you, buyers/clients think you aren't confident
enough. They'll go with someone else who believes wholeheartedly in
their less-than-exceptional product.


So what are you claiming Musk has over promised?


Rick C.

++ Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209


Guest

Tue Feb 05, 2019 3:45 pm   



On Monday, February 4, 2019 at 9:08:33 AM UTC-5, Cursitor Doom wrote:
Quote:
Those batteries just aren't up to it.


www.zerohedge.com/news/2019-02-03/winter-wreaking-havoc-electric-vehicles



--
This message may be freely reproduced without limit or charge only via
the Usenet protocol. Reproduction in whole or part through other
protocols, whether for profit or not, is conditional upon a charge of
GBP10.00 per reproduction. Publication in this manner via non-Usenet
protocols constitutes acceptance of this condition.


And you infer that from the experiences of a handful of incapable people who lack the common sense to wear gloves when they're touching metallic surfaces in cold weather???

Martin Riddle
Guest

Wed Feb 06, 2019 1:45 am   



On Mon, 4 Feb 2019 19:01:44 -0800 (PST), edward.ming.lee_at_gmail.com
wrote:

Quote:
On Monday, February 4, 2019 at 6:53:36 PM UTC-8, Martin Riddle wrote:
On Mon, 04 Feb 2019 07:31:08 -0800, John Larkin
jjlarkin_at_highlandtechnology.com> wrote:

On Mon, 4 Feb 2019 09:40:14 -0500, bitrex <user_at_example.net> wrote:

On 02/04/2019 09:17 AM, gnuarm.deletethisbit_at_gmail.com wrote:
On Monday, February 4, 2019 at 9:08:33 AM UTC-5, Cursitor Doom wrote:
Those batteries just aren't up to it.

No, in the winter they get down! I'll be sure to check on this when I take my next 1500 mile trip. lol


The comments on ZeroHedge are usually worth a laugh though, they're
always from the usual type of comments-dude, who posts on ZeroHedge all
day AND claims to get all the hottest chicks

Is the Fortune article polluted because it's linked from Zero?

Do Teslas run just as well below 0F?

The internal battery heaters are about 1500kw. So with out a super
charger your dead in the water.

Cheers

I am sure you mean 1500w. I run the heater with my Leaf on Level 1 only all the time. It's warm enough when outside is freezing.


Yes, I did mean 1500w.

Cheers


Guest

Wed Feb 06, 2019 1:45 am   



On Tuesday, February 5, 2019 at 6:48:49 PM UTC-5, Martin Riddle wrote:
Quote:
On Mon, 4 Feb 2019 19:01:44 -0800 (PST), edward.ming.lee_at_gmail.com
wrote:

On Monday, February 4, 2019 at 6:53:36 PM UTC-8, Martin Riddle wrote:
On Mon, 04 Feb 2019 07:31:08 -0800, John Larkin
jjlarkin_at_highlandtechnology.com> wrote:

On Mon, 4 Feb 2019 09:40:14 -0500, bitrex <user_at_example.net> wrote:

On 02/04/2019 09:17 AM, gnuarm.deletethisbit_at_gmail.com wrote:
On Monday, February 4, 2019 at 9:08:33 AM UTC-5, Cursitor Doom wrote:
Those batteries just aren't up to it.

No, in the winter they get down! I'll be sure to check on this when I take my next 1500 mile trip. lol


The comments on ZeroHedge are usually worth a laugh though, they're
always from the usual type of comments-dude, who posts on ZeroHedge all
day AND claims to get all the hottest chicks

Is the Fortune article polluted because it's linked from Zero?

Do Teslas run just as well below 0F?

The internal battery heaters are about 1500kw. So with out a super
charger your dead in the water.

Cheers

I am sure you mean 1500w. I run the heater with my Leaf on Level 1 only all the time. It's warm enough when outside is freezing.

Yes, I did mean 1500w.


So what did you mean about the Supercharger?


Rick C.

--- Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209

Martin Riddle
Guest

Wed Feb 06, 2019 3:45 am   



On Tue, 5 Feb 2019 16:10:11 -0800 (PST),
gnuarm.deletethisbit_at_gmail.com wrote:

Quote:
On Tuesday, February 5, 2019 at 6:48:49 PM UTC-5, Martin Riddle wrote:
On Mon, 4 Feb 2019 19:01:44 -0800 (PST), edward.ming.lee_at_gmail.com
wrote:

On Monday, February 4, 2019 at 6:53:36 PM UTC-8, Martin Riddle wrote:
On Mon, 04 Feb 2019 07:31:08 -0800, John Larkin
jjlarkin_at_highlandtechnology.com> wrote:

On Mon, 4 Feb 2019 09:40:14 -0500, bitrex <user_at_example.net> wrote:

On 02/04/2019 09:17 AM, gnuarm.deletethisbit_at_gmail.com wrote:
On Monday, February 4, 2019 at 9:08:33 AM UTC-5, Cursitor Doom wrote:
Those batteries just aren't up to it.

No, in the winter they get down! I'll be sure to check on this when I take my next 1500 mile trip. lol


The comments on ZeroHedge are usually worth a laugh though, they're
always from the usual type of comments-dude, who posts on ZeroHedge all
day AND claims to get all the hottest chicks

Is the Fortune article polluted because it's linked from Zero?

Do Teslas run just as well below 0F?

The internal battery heaters are about 1500kw. So with out a super
charger your dead in the water.

Cheers

I am sure you mean 1500w. I run the heater with my Leaf on Level 1 only all the time. It's warm enough when outside is freezing.

Yes, I did mean 1500w.

So what did you mean about the Supercharger?


Rick C.

--- Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209


You'd need more than 1500w to charge the batteries, hence the super
charger.

Cheers


Guest

Wed Feb 06, 2019 4:45 am   



On Tuesday, February 5, 2019 at 9:38:57 PM UTC-5, Martin Riddle wrote:
Quote:
On Tue, 5 Feb 2019 16:10:11 -0800 (PST),
gnuarm.deletethisbit_at_gmail.com wrote:

On Tuesday, February 5, 2019 at 6:48:49 PM UTC-5, Martin Riddle wrote:
On Mon, 4 Feb 2019 19:01:44 -0800 (PST), edward.ming.lee_at_gmail.com
wrote:

On Monday, February 4, 2019 at 6:53:36 PM UTC-8, Martin Riddle wrote:
On Mon, 04 Feb 2019 07:31:08 -0800, John Larkin
jjlarkin_at_highlandtechnology.com> wrote:

On Mon, 4 Feb 2019 09:40:14 -0500, bitrex <user_at_example.net> wrote:

On 02/04/2019 09:17 AM, gnuarm.deletethisbit_at_gmail.com wrote:
On Monday, February 4, 2019 at 9:08:33 AM UTC-5, Cursitor Doom wrote:
Those batteries just aren't up to it.

No, in the winter they get down! I'll be sure to check on this when I take my next 1500 mile trip. lol


The comments on ZeroHedge are usually worth a laugh though, they're
always from the usual type of comments-dude, who posts on ZeroHedge all
day AND claims to get all the hottest chicks

Is the Fortune article polluted because it's linked from Zero?

Do Teslas run just as well below 0F?

The internal battery heaters are about 1500kw. So with out a super
charger your dead in the water.

Cheers

I am sure you mean 1500w. I run the heater with my Leaf on Level 1 only all the time. It's warm enough when outside is freezing.

Yes, I did mean 1500w.

So what did you mean about the Supercharger?


Rick C.

--- Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209

You'd need more than 1500w to charge the batteries, hence the super
charger.


What are you talking about??? I don't have any problem charging the batteries from a 120 volt, 15 amp outlet that ends up providing about 1 kW to the actual battery due to the design of the charging circuits. 1% of the battery capacity per hour. I've never had a problem with this in temps down to around 7 °F a few nights ago.

I'm not certain how much power the battery heaters use. But they are used to preheat the battery in a "preconditioning" mode that does require a 240 volt connection. No one has ever said you need a Supercharger in your home to use this mode. No one has ever said the heater has to be used at full blast.

So can you explain your thinking???


Rick C.

--+ Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209


Guest

Wed Feb 06, 2019 6:45 pm   



On Tuesday, February 5, 2019 at 6:38:57 PM UTC-8, Martin Riddle wrote:
Quote:
On Tue, 5 Feb 2019 16:10:11 -0800 (PST),
gnuarm.deletethisbit_at_gmail.com wrote:

On Tuesday, February 5, 2019 at 6:48:49 PM UTC-5, Martin Riddle wrote:
On Mon, 4 Feb 2019 19:01:44 -0800 (PST), edward.ming.lee_at_gmail.com
wrote:

On Monday, February 4, 2019 at 6:53:36 PM UTC-8, Martin Riddle wrote:
On Mon, 04 Feb 2019 07:31:08 -0800, John Larkin
jjlarkin_at_highlandtechnology.com> wrote:

On Mon, 4 Feb 2019 09:40:14 -0500, bitrex <user_at_example.net> wrote:

On 02/04/2019 09:17 AM, gnuarm.deletethisbit_at_gmail.com wrote:
On Monday, February 4, 2019 at 9:08:33 AM UTC-5, Cursitor Doom wrote:
Those batteries just aren't up to it.

No, in the winter they get down! I'll be sure to check on this when I take my next 1500 mile trip. lol


The comments on ZeroHedge are usually worth a laugh though, they're
always from the usual type of comments-dude, who posts on ZeroHedge all
day AND claims to get all the hottest chicks

Is the Fortune article polluted because it's linked from Zero?

Do Teslas run just as well below 0F?

The internal battery heaters are about 1500kw. So with out a super
charger your dead in the water.

Cheers

I am sure you mean 1500w. I run the heater with my Leaf on Level 1 only all the time. It's warm enough when outside is freezing.

Yes, I did mean 1500w.

So what did you mean about the Supercharger?


Rick C.

--- Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209

You'd need more than 1500w to charge the batteries, hence the super
charger.

Cheers


Level 1, 120V 15A is 1800W. Even 1500W will work. I can charge my Leaf at level 1 for around 3 to 4 miles per hour, or fully warm the interior with the heat pump, or somewhere in between.

Martin Riddle
Guest

Thu Feb 07, 2019 2:45 am   



On Tue, 5 Feb 2019 19:11:09 -0800 (PST),
gnuarm.deletethisbit_at_gmail.com wrote:

Quote:
On Tuesday, February 5, 2019 at 9:38:57 PM UTC-5, Martin Riddle wrote:
On Tue, 5 Feb 2019 16:10:11 -0800 (PST),
gnuarm.deletethisbit_at_gmail.com wrote:

On Tuesday, February 5, 2019 at 6:48:49 PM UTC-5, Martin Riddle wrote:
On Mon, 4 Feb 2019 19:01:44 -0800 (PST), edward.ming.lee_at_gmail.com
wrote:

On Monday, February 4, 2019 at 6:53:36 PM UTC-8, Martin Riddle wrote:
On Mon, 04 Feb 2019 07:31:08 -0800, John Larkin
jjlarkin_at_highlandtechnology.com> wrote:

On Mon, 4 Feb 2019 09:40:14 -0500, bitrex <user_at_example.net> wrote:

On 02/04/2019 09:17 AM, gnuarm.deletethisbit_at_gmail.com wrote:
On Monday, February 4, 2019 at 9:08:33 AM UTC-5, Cursitor Doom wrote:
Those batteries just aren't up to it.

No, in the winter they get down! I'll be sure to check on this when I take my next 1500 mile trip. lol


The comments on ZeroHedge are usually worth a laugh though, they're
always from the usual type of comments-dude, who posts on ZeroHedge all
day AND claims to get all the hottest chicks

Is the Fortune article polluted because it's linked from Zero?

Do Teslas run just as well below 0F?

The internal battery heaters are about 1500kw. So with out a super
charger your dead in the water.

Cheers

I am sure you mean 1500w. I run the heater with my Leaf on Level 1 only all the time. It's warm enough when outside is freezing.

Yes, I did mean 1500w.

So what did you mean about the Supercharger?


Rick C.

--- Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209

You'd need more than 1500w to charge the batteries, hence the super
charger.

What are you talking about??? I don't have any problem charging the batteries from a 120 volt, 15 amp outlet that ends up providing about 1 kW to the actual battery due to the design of the charging circuits. 1% of the battery capacity per hour. I've never had a problem with this in temps down to around 7 F a few nights ago.

I'm not certain how much power the battery heaters use. But they are used to preheat the battery in a "preconditioning" mode that does require a 240 volt connection. No one has ever said you need a Supercharger in your home to use this mode. No one has ever said the heater has to be used at full blast.

So can you explain your thinking???


Rick C.

--+ Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209


Apparently the Tesla has a battery heater (6kw max). The Model 3 uses
heat from the motor. When the battery is frozen (below 0c) it is
heated up before it can take a charge. The batteries cannot be charged
when they are frozen.
If your taking a charge , then your batteries are not below or at 0c.

Cheers

Lasse Langwadt Christense
Guest

Thu Feb 07, 2019 3:45 am   



https://electronics.stackexchange.com/questions/263036/why-charging-li-ion-batteries-in-cold-temperatures-would-harm-them


Guest

Thu Feb 07, 2019 7:45 pm   



On Wednesday, February 6, 2019 at 8:39:26 PM UTC-5, Martin Riddle wrote:
Quote:
On Tue, 5 Feb 2019 19:11:09 -0800 (PST),
gnuarm.deletethisbit_at_gmail.com wrote:

On Tuesday, February 5, 2019 at 9:38:57 PM UTC-5, Martin Riddle wrote:
On Tue, 5 Feb 2019 16:10:11 -0800 (PST),
gnuarm.deletethisbit_at_gmail.com wrote:

On Tuesday, February 5, 2019 at 6:48:49 PM UTC-5, Martin Riddle wrote:
On Mon, 4 Feb 2019 19:01:44 -0800 (PST), edward.ming.lee_at_gmail.com
wrote:

On Monday, February 4, 2019 at 6:53:36 PM UTC-8, Martin Riddle wrote:
On Mon, 04 Feb 2019 07:31:08 -0800, John Larkin
jjlarkin_at_highlandtechnology.com> wrote:

On Mon, 4 Feb 2019 09:40:14 -0500, bitrex <user_at_example.net> wrote:

On 02/04/2019 09:17 AM, gnuarm.deletethisbit_at_gmail.com wrote:
On Monday, February 4, 2019 at 9:08:33 AM UTC-5, Cursitor Doom wrote:
Those batteries just aren't up to it.

No, in the winter they get down! I'll be sure to check on this when I take my next 1500 mile trip. lol


The comments on ZeroHedge are usually worth a laugh though, they're
always from the usual type of comments-dude, who posts on ZeroHedge all
day AND claims to get all the hottest chicks

Is the Fortune article polluted because it's linked from Zero?

Do Teslas run just as well below 0F?

The internal battery heaters are about 1500kw. So with out a super
charger your dead in the water.

Cheers

I am sure you mean 1500w. I run the heater with my Leaf on Level 1 only all the time. It's warm enough when outside is freezing.

Yes, I did mean 1500w.

So what did you mean about the Supercharger?


Rick C.

--- Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209

You'd need more than 1500w to charge the batteries, hence the super
charger.

What are you talking about??? I don't have any problem charging the batteries from a 120 volt, 15 amp outlet that ends up providing about 1 kW to the actual battery due to the design of the charging circuits. 1% of the battery capacity per hour. I've never had a problem with this in temps down to around 7 °F a few nights ago.

I'm not certain how much power the battery heaters use. But they are used to preheat the battery in a "preconditioning" mode that does require a 240 volt connection. No one has ever said you need a Supercharger in your home to use this mode. No one has ever said the heater has to be used at full blast.

So can you explain your thinking???


Rick C.

--+ Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209

Apparently the Tesla has a battery heater (6kw max). The Model 3 uses
heat from the motor. When the battery is frozen (below 0c) it is
heated up before it can take a charge. The batteries cannot be charged
when they are frozen.
If your taking a charge , then your batteries are not below or at 0c.


That is not correct at all. I'll explain below.

Just to clarify a few things about chargers, remember that for the AC specs, any EV charging in the US draws 80% max by the electrical code since EV charging is considered a "continuous" load.

Level 1 - 120 volts AC, 15 or 20 amps so 1.44 kW or 1.92 kW

Level 2 - 240 volts AC, 15 to 90 amps so 2.88 kW to 17.28 kW

Level 3 - 400 volts DC, ??? amps, Tesla units provide up to 120 kW other units are mostly 50 kW, some newer units reaching >100 kW.

In the home you can have anything in Level 1 or 2. A 240 volt, 50 amp outlet can provide up to 9.6 kW but most Teslas will only draw 7.68 kW because the same connector is used for 50 and 40 amp circuits. Still, 7.68 kW will charge a 100 kWh battery from 0 to 100% overnight. Charging at home is the best way to charge. Even when the battery is below freezing there is typically excess power to charge. Also, I'm not certain that 0°C is the cut off temperature for not charging the battery. I believe it is somewhat lower.


Rick C.

+- Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209


Guest

Thu Feb 07, 2019 9:45 pm   



On Wednesday, February 6, 2019 at 5:45:15 PM UTC-8, Lasse Langwadt Christensen wrote:
> https://electronics.stackexchange.com/questions/263036/why-charging-li-ion-batteries-in-cold-temperatures-would-harm-them

Sound like problem of not having enough power, but too much. It's only a problem for people with fast charger at home. For the rest of us, using level 1 or level 2 to heat up at home, while limiting charging current, would avoid the problem. By the time we drive to a fast charging station, the battery would warm up enough anyway.

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