Ask a question - edaboard.com
elektroda.net NewsGroups Forum Index - Electronics Design - Best small run PCB manufacturer
Tim Williams
Guest
Guest
Fri Jan 13, 2012 3:30 am
"hamilton" <hamilton_at_nothere.com> wrote in message
news:jen5bq$c3s$1_at_dont-email.me...
Quote:
Does anyone know of a Free DRC that is not connected to a PCB house ??
I have found the DRC program with 4pcb.com very useful.
By clicking on the FREEDFM link it sends me to another 4pcb page, so I
guess its their own work.
I have found the DRC program with 4pcb.com very useful.
By clicking on the FREEDFM link it sends me to another 4pcb page, so I
guess its their own work.
FreeDFM is Advanced (4PCB)'s service, which also autogenerates a quote,
handy if you want a quick estimate, even if you buy elsewhere. I
regularly use this service just because it's more-or-less automated and
gets me a quick check. If it passes their proto rules, it should pass
anyone's rules (copper width and spacing, soldermask expansion, annular
rings, etc.) Not affiliated, blah blah..
Tim
--
Deep Friar: a very philosophical monk.
Website: http://webpages.charter.net/dawill/tmoranwms
who where
Guest
Guest
Fri Jan 13, 2012 3:30 am
On Thu, 12 Jan 2012 06:59:52 -0600, "Rick" <rike22_at_bellsouth.net>
wrote:
Quote:
"Dennis" <jon.dough_at_ithemorgue.com> wrote in message
news:fdadnWdPIIe18pPSnZ2dnUVZ_vydnZ2d_at_westnet.com.au...
"Klaus Jensen" <klausjensen_at_nutradyne.com> wrote in message
news:4f0e57bd.147062_at_news.tpg.com.au...
Can anyone tell me, who are the currently preferred "economy" PCB
manufacturers operating online with worldwide postal delivery?
Basic doubled sided. Less than 100 x 100mm in size.
Small runs: 10-25 pcs.
No overlay or mask. Cheap but nice.
Thanks,
Klaus
pcbcart.com
Used by myself and others here. No problems, quality & service is good.
Communications is good.
pcbcart.com I have bought thousands of boards from them with no problem.
12 day delivery standard, overlay and mask no charge.
We have also happily used www.pcbcart.com as our standard fab for
several years, for DS/PTH with mask and overlay. As TTman pointed
out, the masking and overlay are effectively "free" with pcbcart - it
seems to be built into their standard pricing which is quite sensible
from a production point of view. Their communication is excellent and
they will ping you before starting production if they see what appears
to be an error - better than getting a batch of boards with an inbuilt
design cock-up. Saved us time and money once!
Where I specifically don't want masking or overlay (e.g. for
proof-of-concept protos), I have on occasion reverted to
www.futurlec.com where the addition of these adds up quickly, but the
base DS-PTH-HASL price is often better. Their boards were once of
rather variable quality but they got their ducks in line a few years
ago, I suspect by outsourcing to someone in China. Delivery is not as
fast as pcbcart.
who where
Guest
Guest
Fri Jan 13, 2012 3:32 am
On Thu, 12 Jan 2012 03:54:55 GMT, klausjensen_at_nutradyne.com (Klaus
Jensen) wrote:
Quote:
Can anyone tell me, who are the currently preferred "economy" PCB
manufacturers operating online with worldwide postal delivery?
Basic doubled sided. Less than 100 x 100mm in size.
Small runs: 10-25 pcs.
No overlay or mask. Cheap but nice.
manufacturers operating online with worldwide postal delivery?
Basic doubled sided. Less than 100 x 100mm in size.
Small runs: 10-25 pcs.
No overlay or mask. Cheap but nice.
No matter who you choose, you need to check first if their process
handles the file type(s) of your design software.
Guest
Fri Jan 13, 2012 4:47 am
On Jan 12, 12:20燼m, Winston <Wins...@BigBrother.net> wrote:
Quote:
Klaus Jensen wrote:
Can anyone tell me, who are the currently preferred "economy" PCB
manufacturers operating online with worldwide postal delivery?
Basic doubled sided. Less than 100 x 100mm in size.
Small runs: 10-25 pcs.
No overlay or mask. Cheap but nice.
I've heard good things about Olimex though
I've not been a customer:http://www.olimex.com/pcb/
--Winston
Can anyone tell me, who are the currently preferred "economy" PCB
manufacturers operating online with worldwide postal delivery?
Basic doubled sided. Less than 100 x 100mm in size.
Small runs: 10-25 pcs.
No overlay or mask. Cheap but nice.
I've heard good things about Olimex though
I've not been a customer:http://www.olimex.com/pcb/
--Winston
They do good work, but the shipping delay can annoy some. For a back-
burner hobby project, a 2-3 week wait is fine considering the high
quality of the product.
However things change quickly and I suppose many Asian fabs are hungry
for business.
DA
Guest
Guest
Fri Jan 13, 2012 6:22 am
responding to
http://www.electrondepot.com/electrodesign/best-small-run-pcb-manufacturer-619528-.htm
DA wrote:
a7yvm109gf5d1 wrote:
Quote:
However things change quickly and I suppose many Asian fabs are hungry
for business.
for business.
That's true but not during the Chinese New Year festivities
Most
Chinese PCB houses are closed or will close very soon till the end of
January.
-------------------------------------
/_/
((@v@))
()::
)
VV-VV
Nico Coesel
Guest
Guest
Fri Jan 13, 2012 9:53 am
Jon Elson <jmelson_at_wustl.edu> wrote:
Quote:
Klaus Jensen wrote:
Can anyone tell me, who are the currently preferred "economy" PCB
manufacturers operating online with worldwide postal delivery?
Basic doubled sided. Less than 100 x 100mm in size.
Small runs: 10-25 pcs.
No overlay or mask. Cheap but nice.
I use E-Teknet in Arizona, US. They may not be the cheapest, but probably
pretty close. You get excellent quality, I have had over 100 designs done
with them. I have had all sorts of problems with boards done by other
outfits. My biggest pain was paying for electrical test, and then finding
shorts in boards AFTER all the parts were installed. This can be REALLY
difficult to fix on a 4- or 6-layer board.
Can anyone tell me, who are the currently preferred "economy" PCB
manufacturers operating online with worldwide postal delivery?
Basic doubled sided. Less than 100 x 100mm in size.
Small runs: 10-25 pcs.
No overlay or mask. Cheap but nice.
I use E-Teknet in Arizona, US. They may not be the cheapest, but probably
pretty close. You get excellent quality, I have had over 100 designs done
with them. I have had all sorts of problems with boards done by other
outfits. My biggest pain was paying for electrical test, and then finding
shorts in boards AFTER all the parts were installed. This can be REALLY
difficult to fix on a 4- or 6-layer board.
I use Eurocircuits. They scan PCBs with a special flatbed scanner to
look for shorts and opens.
--
Failure does not prove something is impossible, failure simply
indicates you are not using the right tools...
nico_at_nctdevpuntnl (punt=.)
--------------------------------------------------------------
TTman
Guest
Guest
Fri Jan 13, 2012 5:31 pm
Quote:
pcbcart.com
Used by myself and others here. No problems, quality & service is good.
Communications is good.
pcbcart.com I have bought thousands of boards from them with no problem.
12 day delivery standard, overlay and mask no charge.
We have also happily used www.pcbcart.com as our standard fab for
several years, for DS/PTH with mask and overlay. As TTman pointed
out, the masking and overlay are effectively "free" with pcbcart - it
seems to be built into their standard pricing which is quite sensible
from a production point of view. Their communication is excellent and
they will ping you before starting production if they see what appears
to be an error - better than getting a batch of boards with an inbuilt
design cock-up. Saved us time and money once!
Used by myself and others here. No problems, quality & service is good.
Communications is good.
pcbcart.com I have bought thousands of boards from them with no problem.
12 day delivery standard, overlay and mask no charge.
We have also happily used www.pcbcart.com as our standard fab for
several years, for DS/PTH with mask and overlay. As TTman pointed
out, the masking and overlay are effectively "free" with pcbcart - it
seems to be built into their standard pricing which is quite sensible
from a production point of view. Their communication is excellent and
they will ping you before starting production if they see what appears
to be an error - better than getting a batch of boards with an inbuilt
design cock-up. Saved us time and money once!
I missed that very important point. More than once their front end check has
picked up silly mistakes I had made. That alone is worth untold money.... OK
so I get a delay of a couple of days. Life isn't that short.
ka suarez
Guest
Guest
Fri Jan 13, 2012 6:48 pm
On 1月12日, 上午11时54分, klausjen...@nutradyne.com (Klaus Jensen) wrote:
Quote:
Can anyone tell me, who are the currently preferred "economy" PCB
manufacturers operating online with worldwide postal delivery?
Basic doubled sided. Less than 100 x 100mm in size.
Small runs: 10-25 pcs.
No overlay or mask. Cheap but nice.
Thanks,
Klaus
manufacturers operating online with worldwide postal delivery?
Basic doubled sided. Less than 100 x 100mm in size.
Small runs: 10-25 pcs.
No overlay or mask. Cheap but nice.
Thanks,
Klaus
I've take some boards on Onlypcb,china manufacture,not bad,may be you
could try it.
cassiope
Guest
Guest
Fri Jan 13, 2012 8:07 pm
On Jan 12, 12:05爌m, Jon Elson <jmel...@wustl.edu> wrote:
Quote:
Klaus Jensen wrote:
Can anyone tell me, who are the currently preferred "economy" PCB
manufacturers operating online with worldwide postal delivery?
Basic doubled sided. Less than 100 x 100mm in size.
Small runs: 10-25 pcs.
No overlay or mask. Cheap but nice.
I use E-Teknet in Arizona, US. 燭hey may not be the cheapest, but probably
pretty close. 燳ou get excellent quality, I have had over 100 designs done
with them. 營 have had all sorts of problems with boards done by other
outfits. 燤y biggest pain was paying for electrical test, and then finding
shorts in boards AFTER all the parts were installed. 燭his can be REALLY
difficult to fix on a 4- or 6-layer board.
Jon
Can anyone tell me, who are the currently preferred "economy" PCB
manufacturers operating online with worldwide postal delivery?
Basic doubled sided. Less than 100 x 100mm in size.
Small runs: 10-25 pcs.
No overlay or mask. Cheap but nice.
I use E-Teknet in Arizona, US. 燭hey may not be the cheapest, but probably
pretty close. 燳ou get excellent quality, I have had over 100 designs done
with them. 營 have had all sorts of problems with boards done by other
outfits. 燤y biggest pain was paying for electrical test, and then finding
shorts in boards AFTER all the parts were installed. 燭his can be REALLY
difficult to fix on a 4- or 6-layer board.
Jon
How did they reconcile the electrical test vs. the shorts?
---
We've mostly used Advanced Circuits for multilayer boards, generally
without
(paying for) the electrical testing. Mostly we try to avoid pushing
the design rules
too closely. This hasn't always worked - we've had occasional opens,
and most
recently a serious inner layer short on one board (not fixable). On
one occasion
AdvPCB forgot to put the insulating layer between copper layers 2&3 -
they
remade the boards at their cost in that case.
Suarez
Guest
Guest
Fri Jan 13, 2012 8:14 pm
On 1月14日, 上午2时07分, cassiope <f...@u.washington.edu> wrote:
Quote:
On Jan 12, 12:05 pm, Jon Elson <jmel...@wustl.edu> wrote:
Klaus Jensen wrote:
Can anyone tell me, who are the currently preferred "economy" PCB
manufacturers operating online with worldwide postal delivery?
Basic doubled sided. Less than 100 x 100mm in size.
Small runs: 10-25 pcs.
No overlay or mask. Cheap but nice.
I use E-Teknet in Arizona, US. They may not be the cheapest, but probably
pretty close. You get excellent quality, I have had over 100 designs done
with them. I have had all sorts of problems with boards done by other
outfits. My biggest pain was paying for electrical test, and then finding
shorts in boards AFTER all the parts were installed. This can be REALLY
difficult to fix on a 4- or 6-layer board.
Jon
How did they reconcile the electrical test vs. the shorts?
---
We've mostly used Advanced Circuits for multilayer boards, generally
without
(paying for) the electrical testing. Mostly we try to avoid pushing
the design rules
too closely. This hasn't always worked - we've had occasional opens,
and most
recently a serious inner layer short on one board (not fixable). On
one occasion
AdvPCB forgot to put the insulating layer between copper layers 2&3 -
they
remade the boards at their cost in that case.
Klaus Jensen wrote:
Can anyone tell me, who are the currently preferred "economy" PCB
manufacturers operating online with worldwide postal delivery?
Basic doubled sided. Less than 100 x 100mm in size.
Small runs: 10-25 pcs.
No overlay or mask. Cheap but nice.
I use E-Teknet in Arizona, US. They may not be the cheapest, but probably
pretty close. You get excellent quality, I have had over 100 designs done
with them. I have had all sorts of problems with boards done by other
outfits. My biggest pain was paying for electrical test, and then finding
shorts in boards AFTER all the parts were installed. This can be REALLY
difficult to fix on a 4- or 6-layer board.
Jon
How did they reconcile the electrical test vs. the shorts?
---
We've mostly used Advanced Circuits for multilayer boards, generally
without
(paying for) the electrical testing. Mostly we try to avoid pushing
the design rules
too closely. This hasn't always worked - we've had occasional opens,
and most
recently a serious inner layer short on one board (not fixable). On
one occasion
AdvPCB forgot to put the insulating layer between copper layers 2&3 -
they
remade the boards at their cost in that case.
I've take some 4Layer boards from www.onlypcb.com that make me
surprise,good quality.
Rob L
Guest
Guest
Fri Jan 13, 2012 11:25 pm
"who where" <noone_at_home.net> wrote in message
news:6r5vg7lvtpgvm76a380dvt00gtdfmrpeoq_at_4ax.com...
Quote:
On Thu, 12 Jan 2012 03:54:55 GMT, klausjensen_at_nutradyne.com (Klaus
Jensen) wrote:
Can anyone tell me, who are the currently preferred "economy" PCB
manufacturers operating online with worldwide postal delivery?
Basic doubled sided. Less than 100 x 100mm in size.
Small runs: 10-25 pcs.
No overlay or mask. Cheap but nice.
No matter who you choose, you need to check first if their process
handles the file type(s) of your design software.
Jensen) wrote:
Can anyone tell me, who are the currently preferred "economy" PCB
manufacturers operating online with worldwide postal delivery?
Basic doubled sided. Less than 100 x 100mm in size.
Small runs: 10-25 pcs.
No overlay or mask. Cheap but nice.
No matter who you choose, you need to check first if their process
handles the file type(s) of your design software.
You mean to say that you have found somewhere that doesn't handle Gerbers??
Must be somthing very special
--- Posted via news://freenews.netfront.net/ - Complaints to news_at_netfront.net ---
Jon Elson
Guest
Guest
Sat Jan 14, 2012 12:16 am
cassiope wrote:
Quote:
How did they reconcile the electrical test vs. the shorts?
Well, we just moved to another supplier! One error of that sort
Well, we just moved to another supplier! One error of that sort
and we just blacklisted them forever.
Quote:
---
We've mostly used Advanced Circuits for multilayer boards, generally
without
(paying for) the electrical testing. Mostly we try to avoid pushing
the design rules
too closely. This hasn't always worked - we've had occasional opens,
and most
recently a serious inner layer short on one board (not fixable).
Well, once I have several hundred $ of parts on a big board, I sure don't
We've mostly used Advanced Circuits for multilayer boards, generally
without
(paying for) the electrical testing. Mostly we try to avoid pushing
the design rules
too closely. This hasn't always worked - we've had occasional opens,
and most
recently a serious inner layer short on one board (not fixable).
Well, once I have several hundred $ of parts on a big board, I sure don't
want to scrap it. I had to put several amps into the power/ground plane
and then observe millivolt differences to try to localize the short.
When I got real close, I then shined a bright light on the back of the
board and looked through the window around the PTH's until I found one that
looked suspicious. I then carved into the board with an X-acto knife
until I cut the short. Probably cost me 4 hours to fix one board.
Anyway, most vendors will just credit you the $15 or whatever you paid for
the per-board part of the order. BIG DEAL! I want their heads mounted on a
pole as a warning to other vendors. I can tell by tiny prick marks in the
pads when a board has actually been electrically tested on the flying probe
tester. Every board ought to have those marks, or I am being cheated by
the fabricator. I think the logic is they test the first 5 boards of the
lot, and if they pass, they just mark the whole rest of the lot OK.
Anybody who does this ought to be fired on the spot. So, now that I have
found a fabricator who really DOES make sure there are no screwups or
shortcuts, I am very reluctant to switch.
Quote:
On one occasion
AdvPCB forgot to put the insulating layer between copper layers 2&3 -
they remade the boards at their cost in that case.
Gee, I sure HOPE SO! How the heck did that get through electrical test?
AdvPCB forgot to put the insulating layer between copper layers 2&3 -
they remade the boards at their cost in that case.
Gee, I sure HOPE SO! How the heck did that get through electrical test?
Did they use the first board as the "golden board" and then check all others
against the first? Brilliant plan - unless there is a systematic error in
all the boards! Well, I had some similar experiences with Adv. Circuits
years ago, where they opened up the power plane clearances on a batch of
boards without my authorization. I had already checked the power and
ground plane continuity at the specified clearance, so when the opened it
up it cut some of the planes. I never knew how these got past electrical
test, but they had to remake that batch. For this reason, the tester should
be programmed from the board layout, NOT from a "golden board" unless you
KNOW that it is truly correct.
Jon
Robert Macy
Guest
Guest
Sat Jan 14, 2012 10:35 pm
On Jan 13, 4:16爌m, Jon Elson <jmel...@wustl.edu> wrote:
Quote:
cassiope wrote:
How did they reconcile the electrical test vs. the shorts?
Well, we just moved to another supplier! 燨ne error of that sort
and we just blacklisted them forever.> ---
We've mostly used Advanced Circuits for multilayer boards, generally
without
(paying for) the electrical testing. 燤ostly we try to avoid pushing
the design rules
too closely. 燭his hasn't always worked - we've had occasional opens,
and most
recently a serious inner layer short on one board (not fixable).
Well, once I have several hundred $ of parts on a big board, I sure don't
want to scrap it. 營 had to put several amps into the power/ground plane
and then observe millivolt differences to try to localize the short.
When I got real close, I then shined a bright light on the back of the
board and looked through the window around the PTH's until I found one that
looked suspicious. 營 then carved into the board with an X-acto knife
until I cut the short. 燩robably cost me 4 hours to fix one board.
Anyway, most vendors will just credit you the $15 or whatever you paid for
the per-board part of the order. 燘IG DEAL! 營 want their heads mounted on a
pole as a warning to other vendors. 營 can tell by tiny prick marks in the
pads when a board 爃as actually been electrically tested on the flying probe
tester. 燛very board ought to have those marks, or I am being cheated by
the fabricator. 營 think the logic is they test the first 5 boards of the
lot, and if they pass, they just mark the whole rest of the lot OK.
Anybody who does this ought to be fired on the spot. 燬o, now that I have
found a fabricator who really DOES make sure there are no screwups or
shortcuts, I am very reluctant to switch.
On one occasion
AdvPCB forgot to put the insulating layer between copper layers 2&3 -
they remade the boards at their cost in that case.
Gee, I sure HOPE SO! 燞ow the heck did that get through electrical test?
Did they use the first board as the "golden board" and then check all others
against the first? 燘rilliant plan - unless there is a systematic error in
all the boards! 燱ell, I had some similar experiences with Adv. Circuits
years ago, where they opened up the power plane clearances on a batch of
boards without my authorization. 營 had already checked the power and
ground plane continuity at the specified clearance, so when the opened it
up it cut some of the planes. 營 never knew how these got past electrical
test, but they had to remake that batch. 燜or this reason, the tester should
be programmed from the board layout, NOT from a "golden board" unless you
KNOW that it is truly correct.
Jon
How did they reconcile the electrical test vs. the shorts?
Well, we just moved to another supplier! 燨ne error of that sort
and we just blacklisted them forever.> ---
We've mostly used Advanced Circuits for multilayer boards, generally
without
(paying for) the electrical testing. 燤ostly we try to avoid pushing
the design rules
too closely. 燭his hasn't always worked - we've had occasional opens,
and most
recently a serious inner layer short on one board (not fixable).
Well, once I have several hundred $ of parts on a big board, I sure don't
want to scrap it. 營 had to put several amps into the power/ground plane
and then observe millivolt differences to try to localize the short.
When I got real close, I then shined a bright light on the back of the
board and looked through the window around the PTH's until I found one that
looked suspicious. 營 then carved into the board with an X-acto knife
until I cut the short. 燩robably cost me 4 hours to fix one board.
Anyway, most vendors will just credit you the $15 or whatever you paid for
the per-board part of the order. 燘IG DEAL! 營 want their heads mounted on a
pole as a warning to other vendors. 營 can tell by tiny prick marks in the
pads when a board 爃as actually been electrically tested on the flying probe
tester. 燛very board ought to have those marks, or I am being cheated by
the fabricator. 營 think the logic is they test the first 5 boards of the
lot, and if they pass, they just mark the whole rest of the lot OK.
Anybody who does this ought to be fired on the spot. 燬o, now that I have
found a fabricator who really DOES make sure there are no screwups or
shortcuts, I am very reluctant to switch.
On one occasion
AdvPCB forgot to put the insulating layer between copper layers 2&3 -
they remade the boards at their cost in that case.
Gee, I sure HOPE SO! 燞ow the heck did that get through electrical test?
Did they use the first board as the "golden board" and then check all others
against the first? 燘rilliant plan - unless there is a systematic error in
all the boards! 燱ell, I had some similar experiences with Adv. Circuits
years ago, where they opened up the power plane clearances on a batch of
boards without my authorization. 營 had already checked the power and
ground plane continuity at the specified clearance, so when the opened it
up it cut some of the planes. 營 never knew how these got past electrical
test, but they had to remake that batch. 燜or this reason, the tester should
be programmed from the board layout, NOT from a "golden board" unless you
KNOW that it is truly correct.
Jon
The 'error' that caught me off guard was when the PCB Fab house found
a large blank area to leave metal letters describing their firm and
the part number and the llot run info - RIGHT IN THE MIDDLE OF A HIGH
VOLTAGE GAP! All without asking. In defense, the board WAS small and
there was no other location, but still.
elektroda.net NewsGroups Forum Index - Electronics Design - Best small run PCB manufacturer
