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linnix
Guest
Guest
Fri Mar 05, 2010 11:28 pm
On Mar 5, 1:21 pm, Tim Wescott <t...@seemywebsite.now> wrote:
Quote:
linnix wrote:
On Mar 5, 1:11 pm, Tim Wescott <t...@seemywebsite.now> wrote:
Chris wrote:
On Mar 5, 11:11 am, Chris <christopher.man...@gmail.com> wrote:
I have posted several threads about converting 24Hz pulses to 60Hz
basically a 5/2 ratio. I tried a phase locked loop, it sorta works,
but my chip count is getting high, and I am thinking about making more
of these and selling them if I can write a computer program to resolve
wave sound files.
Therefore, since I am not very familiar with micro controllers, I was
not planning on using one. However, I remember an engineer friend of
mine mentioning the BASIC stamp. I have dabbled in BASIC so, I might
approach the problem with this as a solution, especially if I can do
it with one or two chips.
I would think that I could sample the 24Hz side for one second. Take
that number and use it to divide a much higher frequency quartz
reference by some large value of N so that I can get it back down to
60Hz. Therefore my lock time would be one second. I can have an easy
lock indication and a fairly fast response to any changes in
frequency.
What do you guys/gals think?
Regards,
Chris Maness
Holy crap, I did not realize that these things are $80 for a one off.
OK, awkward, inaccurate, and expensive.
and incomplete. What is the "24Hz pulses" in relation to the "wave
sound file"? Do you need to FFT the signal?
It's a continuation of an earlier post, wherein he describes the whole
thing.
--
Tim Wescott
Control system and signal processing consultingwww.wescottdesign.com
On Mar 5, 1:11 pm, Tim Wescott <t...@seemywebsite.now> wrote:
Chris wrote:
On Mar 5, 11:11 am, Chris <christopher.man...@gmail.com> wrote:
I have posted several threads about converting 24Hz pulses to 60Hz
basically a 5/2 ratio. I tried a phase locked loop, it sorta works,
but my chip count is getting high, and I am thinking about making more
of these and selling them if I can write a computer program to resolve
wave sound files.
Therefore, since I am not very familiar with micro controllers, I was
not planning on using one. However, I remember an engineer friend of
mine mentioning the BASIC stamp. I have dabbled in BASIC so, I might
approach the problem with this as a solution, especially if I can do
it with one or two chips.
I would think that I could sample the 24Hz side for one second. Take
that number and use it to divide a much higher frequency quartz
reference by some large value of N so that I can get it back down to
60Hz. Therefore my lock time would be one second. I can have an easy
lock indication and a fairly fast response to any changes in
frequency.
What do you guys/gals think?
Regards,
Chris Maness
Holy crap, I did not realize that these things are $80 for a one off.
OK, awkward, inaccurate, and expensive.
and incomplete. What is the "24Hz pulses" in relation to the "wave
sound file"? Do you need to FFT the signal?
It's a continuation of an earlier post, wherein he describes the whole
thing.
--
Tim Wescott
Control system and signal processing consultingwww.wescottdesign.com
I didn't read the earlier post. Can you summarize what he is trying
to do?
Spehro Pefhany
Guest
Guest
Fri Mar 05, 2010 11:29 pm
On Fri, 5 Mar 2010 12:32:47 -0800 (PST), Chris
<christopher.maness_at_gmail.com> wrote:
Quote:
On Mar 5, 11:59 am, Jan Panteltje <pNaonStpealm...@yahoo.com> wrote:
On a sunny day (Fri, 5 Mar 2010 11:11:38 -0800 (PST)) it happened Chris
christopher.man...@gmail.com> wrote in
29529065-09fc-4636-9a29-c618cbc16...@x1g2000prb.googlegroups.com>:
I have posted several threads about converting 24Hz pulses to 60Hz
basically a 5/2 ratio. I tried a phase locked loop, it sorta works,
but my chip count is getting high, and I am thinking about making more
of these and selling them if I can write a computer program to resolve
wave sound files.
Therefore, since I am not very familiar with micro controllers, I was
not planning on using one. However, I remember an engineer friend of
mine mentioning the BASIC stamp. I have dabbled in BASIC so, I might
approach the problem with this as a solution, especially if I can do
it with one or two chips.
I would think that I could sample the 24Hz side for one second. Take
that number and use it to divide a much higher frequency quartz
reference by some large value of N so that I can get it back down to
60Hz. Therefore my lock time would be one second. I can have an easy
lock indication and a fairly fast response to any changes in
frequency.
What do you guys/gals think?
Regards,
Chris Maness
Years ago I posted a PIC 50 Hz PLL asm code here.
Or maybe it was 25 Hz.
I would not bother with BASIC, likely way too slow, and way too much resources hungry.
A 1$50 12 pin PIC should do...
What are some models that would be good for that application. I see
some 8 pin models that are only $2. The only problem is that I have
NO clue how to start programming them.
Regards,
Chris
On a sunny day (Fri, 5 Mar 2010 11:11:38 -0800 (PST)) it happened Chris
christopher.man...@gmail.com> wrote in
29529065-09fc-4636-9a29-c618cbc16...@x1g2000prb.googlegroups.com>:
I have posted several threads about converting 24Hz pulses to 60Hz
basically a 5/2 ratio. I tried a phase locked loop, it sorta works,
but my chip count is getting high, and I am thinking about making more
of these and selling them if I can write a computer program to resolve
wave sound files.
Therefore, since I am not very familiar with micro controllers, I was
not planning on using one. However, I remember an engineer friend of
mine mentioning the BASIC stamp. I have dabbled in BASIC so, I might
approach the problem with this as a solution, especially if I can do
it with one or two chips.
I would think that I could sample the 24Hz side for one second. Take
that number and use it to divide a much higher frequency quartz
reference by some large value of N so that I can get it back down to
60Hz. Therefore my lock time would be one second. I can have an easy
lock indication and a fairly fast response to any changes in
frequency.
What do you guys/gals think?
Regards,
Chris Maness
Years ago I posted a PIC 50 Hz PLL asm code here.
Or maybe it was 25 Hz.
I would not bother with BASIC, likely way too slow, and way too much resources hungry.
A 1$50 12 pin PIC should do...
What are some models that would be good for that application. I see
some 8 pin models that are only $2. The only problem is that I have
NO clue how to start programming them.
Regards,
Chris
Just write code to initialize and make an LED flash at a visible rate.
The rest is easy...
Chris
Guest
Guest
Fri Mar 05, 2010 11:30 pm
On Mar 5, 12:55 pm, linnix <m...@linnix.info-for.us> wrote:
Quote:
On Mar 5, 11:11 am, Chris <christopher.man...@gmail.com> wrote:
I have posted several threads about converting 24Hz pulses to 60Hz
basically a 5/2 ratio. I tried a phase locked loop, it sorta works,
but my chip count is getting high, and I am thinking about making more
of these and selling them if I can write a computer program to resolve
wave sound files.
Therefore, since I am not very familiar with micro controllers, I was
not planning on using one. However, I remember an engineer friend of
mine mentioning the BASIC stamp. I have dabbled in BASIC so, I might
approach the problem with this as a solution, especially if I can do
it with one or two chips.
I would think that I could sample the 24Hz side for one second. Take
that number and use it to divide a much higher frequency quartz
reference by some large value of N so that I can get it back down to
60Hz. Therefore my lock time would be one second. I can have an easy
lock indication and a fairly fast response to any changes in
frequency.
If your signal is 24Hz, where is the changes in frequency coming
from? We need to know more about the spec first.
What do you guys/gals think?
Regards,
Chris Maness
I have posted several threads about converting 24Hz pulses to 60Hz
basically a 5/2 ratio. I tried a phase locked loop, it sorta works,
but my chip count is getting high, and I am thinking about making more
of these and selling them if I can write a computer program to resolve
wave sound files.
Therefore, since I am not very familiar with micro controllers, I was
not planning on using one. However, I remember an engineer friend of
mine mentioning the BASIC stamp. I have dabbled in BASIC so, I might
approach the problem with this as a solution, especially if I can do
it with one or two chips.
I would think that I could sample the 24Hz side for one second. Take
that number and use it to divide a much higher frequency quartz
reference by some large value of N so that I can get it back down to
60Hz. Therefore my lock time would be one second. I can have an easy
lock indication and a fairly fast response to any changes in
frequency.
If your signal is 24Hz, where is the changes in frequency coming
from? We need to know more about the spec first.
What do you guys/gals think?
Regards,
Chris Maness
It comes from the flash contact from a small gauge movie camera.
These cameras have very low precision speed control. Ideally they
would run at exactly at 24Hz. The design is to record the error on a
second track and use a fullcoat deck or a computer to resolve later.
The design would do something similar to:
http://www.webtfg.com/sync11.htm
Regards,
Chris
Chris
Guest
Guest
Fri Mar 05, 2010 11:33 pm
On Mar 5, 1:12 pm, Tim Wescott <t...@seemywebsite.now> wrote:
Quote:
Jan Panteltje wrote:
On a sunny day (Fri, 5 Mar 2010 12:32:47 -0800 (PST)) it happened Chris
christopher.man...@gmail.com> wrote in
248a815a-80f1-425c-8bbe-fe9a2829b...@g8g2000pri.googlegroups.com>:
On Mar 5, 11:59 am, Jan Panteltje <pNaonStpealm...@yahoo.com> wrote:
On a sunny day (Fri, 5 Mar 2010 11:11:38 -0800 (PST)) it happened Chris
christopher.man...@gmail.com> wrote in
29529065-09fc-4636-9a29-c618cbc16...@x1g2000prb.googlegroups.com>:
I have posted several threads about converting 24Hz pulses to 60Hz
basically a 5/2 ratio. I tried a phase locked loop, it sorta works,
but my chip count is getting high, and I am thinking about making more
of these and selling them if I can write a computer program to resolve
wave sound files.
Therefore, since I am not very familiar with micro controllers, I was
not planning on using one. However, I remember an engineer friend of
mine mentioning the BASIC stamp. I have dabbled in BASIC so, I might
approach the problem with this as a solution, especially if I can do
it with one or two chips.
I would think that I could sample the 24Hz side for one second. Take
that number and use it to divide a much higher frequency quartz
reference by some large value of N so that I can get it back down to
60Hz. Therefore my lock time would be one second. I can have an ea> >> sy
lock indication and a fairly fast response to any changes in
frequency.
What do you guys/gals think?
Regards,
Chris Maness
Years ago I posted a PIC 50 Hz PLL asm code here.
Or maybe it was 25 Hz.
I would not bother with BASIC, likely way too slow, and way too much reso> >> urces hungry.
A 1$50 12 pin PIC should do...
What are some models that would be good for that application. I see
some 8 pin models that are only $2. The only problem is that I have
NO clue how to start programming them.
Regards,
Chris
I dunno, how many I/O pins, what clock speed,
do you need any thing else like an ADC or comparators, EEPROM?
I used a 12F629.
You need a programmer, can be made yourself for a few $,
or buy one for a lot of dollars, like 50$ even.
Then you need MPLAB from Microchip, the PC software development environment.
I do no tuse that either, I wrote my own programmer software and use Linux and gpasm.
You DO need an oscilloscope in my opinion, else no clue what PIC does.
But then you need an oscilloscope for an analog PLL, or no clue what
it's doing.
--
Tim Wescott
Control system and signal processing consultingwww.wescottdesign.com
On a sunny day (Fri, 5 Mar 2010 12:32:47 -0800 (PST)) it happened Chris
christopher.man...@gmail.com> wrote in
248a815a-80f1-425c-8bbe-fe9a2829b...@g8g2000pri.googlegroups.com>:
On Mar 5, 11:59 am, Jan Panteltje <pNaonStpealm...@yahoo.com> wrote:
On a sunny day (Fri, 5 Mar 2010 11:11:38 -0800 (PST)) it happened Chris
christopher.man...@gmail.com> wrote in
29529065-09fc-4636-9a29-c618cbc16...@x1g2000prb.googlegroups.com>:
I have posted several threads about converting 24Hz pulses to 60Hz
basically a 5/2 ratio. I tried a phase locked loop, it sorta works,
but my chip count is getting high, and I am thinking about making more
of these and selling them if I can write a computer program to resolve
wave sound files.
Therefore, since I am not very familiar with micro controllers, I was
not planning on using one. However, I remember an engineer friend of
mine mentioning the BASIC stamp. I have dabbled in BASIC so, I might
approach the problem with this as a solution, especially if I can do
it with one or two chips.
I would think that I could sample the 24Hz side for one second. Take
that number and use it to divide a much higher frequency quartz
reference by some large value of N so that I can get it back down to
60Hz. Therefore my lock time would be one second. I can have an ea> >> sy
lock indication and a fairly fast response to any changes in
frequency.
What do you guys/gals think?
Regards,
Chris Maness
Years ago I posted a PIC 50 Hz PLL asm code here.
Or maybe it was 25 Hz.
I would not bother with BASIC, likely way too slow, and way too much reso> >> urces hungry.
A 1$50 12 pin PIC should do...
What are some models that would be good for that application. I see
some 8 pin models that are only $2. The only problem is that I have
NO clue how to start programming them.
Regards,
Chris
I dunno, how many I/O pins, what clock speed,
do you need any thing else like an ADC or comparators, EEPROM?
I used a 12F629.
You need a programmer, can be made yourself for a few $,
or buy one for a lot of dollars, like 50$ even.
Then you need MPLAB from Microchip, the PC software development environment.
I do no tuse that either, I wrote my own programmer software and use Linux and gpasm.
You DO need an oscilloscope in my opinion, else no clue what PIC does.
But then you need an oscilloscope for an analog PLL, or no clue what
it's doing.
--
Tim Wescott
Control system and signal processing consultingwww.wescottdesign.com
I have a Scope and Frequency Counter. I had the scope, but I bought
the the freq. counter for this project.
Chris
Jan Panteltje
Guest
Guest
Fri Mar 05, 2010 11:43 pm
On a sunny day (Fri, 05 Mar 2010 13:12:55 -0800) it happened Tim Wescott
<tim_at_seemywebsite.now> wrote in
<rKGdnSd76K6p6QzWnZ2dnUVZ_oYAAAAA_at_web-ster.com>:
Quote:
You DO need an oscilloscope in my opinion, else no clue what PIC does.
But then you need an oscilloscope for an analog PLL, or no clue what
it's doing.
But then you need an oscilloscope for an analog PLL, or no clue what
it's doing.
As we play with electrons, and those are so small we cannot see them,
we will always need some instrument.
A digital voltmeter on a PIC output does give a nice voltage depending on the
duty cycle though.
If you play with the PLL in the audio range, you can get a lot of info by feeding it into an amp.
Even for higher frequencies by AC coupling the error voltage into an audio amp... etc etc.
All tricks I have used.
A 4046 makes a great audio FM modulator and demodulator too.
linnix
Guest
Guest
Fri Mar 05, 2010 11:46 pm
On Mar 5, 1:30 pm, Chris <christopher.man...@gmail.com> wrote:
Quote:
On Mar 5, 12:55 pm, linnix <m...@linnix.info-for.us> wrote:
On Mar 5, 11:11 am, Chris <christopher.man...@gmail.com> wrote:
I have posted several threads about converting 24Hz pulses to 60Hz
basically a 5/2 ratio. I tried a phase locked loop, it sorta works,
but my chip count is getting high, and I am thinking about making more
of these and selling them if I can write a computer program to resolve
wave sound files.
Therefore, since I am not very familiar with micro controllers, I was
not planning on using one. However, I remember an engineer friend of
mine mentioning the BASIC stamp. I have dabbled in BASIC so, I might
approach the problem with this as a solution, especially if I can do
it with one or two chips.
I would think that I could sample the 24Hz side for one second. Take
that number and use it to divide a much higher frequency quartz
reference by some large value of N so that I can get it back down to
60Hz. Therefore my lock time would be one second. I can have an easy
lock indication and a fairly fast response to any changes in
frequency.
If your signal is 24Hz, where is the changes in frequency coming
from? We need to know more about the spec first.
What do you guys/gals think?
Regards,
Chris Maness
It comes from the flash contact from a small gauge movie camera.
These cameras have very low precision speed control. Ideally they
would run at exactly at 24Hz. The design is to record the error on a
second track and use a fullcoat deck or a computer to resolve later.
The design would do something similar to:
http://www.webtfg.com/sync11.htm
Regards,
Chris
On Mar 5, 11:11 am, Chris <christopher.man...@gmail.com> wrote:
I have posted several threads about converting 24Hz pulses to 60Hz
basically a 5/2 ratio. I tried a phase locked loop, it sorta works,
but my chip count is getting high, and I am thinking about making more
of these and selling them if I can write a computer program to resolve
wave sound files.
Therefore, since I am not very familiar with micro controllers, I was
not planning on using one. However, I remember an engineer friend of
mine mentioning the BASIC stamp. I have dabbled in BASIC so, I might
approach the problem with this as a solution, especially if I can do
it with one or two chips.
I would think that I could sample the 24Hz side for one second. Take
that number and use it to divide a much higher frequency quartz
reference by some large value of N so that I can get it back down to
60Hz. Therefore my lock time would be one second. I can have an easy
lock indication and a fairly fast response to any changes in
frequency.
If your signal is 24Hz, where is the changes in frequency coming
from? We need to know more about the spec first.
What do you guys/gals think?
Regards,
Chris Maness
It comes from the flash contact from a small gauge movie camera.
These cameras have very low precision speed control. Ideally they
would run at exactly at 24Hz. The design is to record the error on a
second track and use a fullcoat deck or a computer to resolve later.
The design would do something similar to:
http://www.webtfg.com/sync11.htm
Regards,
Chris
OK, why can't you record the 24Hz and a stable 60Hz together and
resolve them later. On the other hand, sampling the 24Hz at 1.44KHz
rate and recreate a 60Hz is doable with a micro.
linnix
Guest
Guest
Fri Mar 05, 2010 11:53 pm
On Mar 5, 1:35 pm, Tim Wescott <t...@seemywebsite.now> wrote:
Quote:
linnix wrote:
On Mar 5, 1:21 pm, Tim Wescott <t...@seemywebsite.now> wrote:
linnix wrote:
On Mar 5, 1:11 pm, Tim Wescott <t...@seemywebsite.now> wrote:
Chris wrote:
On Mar 5, 11:11 am, Chris <christopher.man...@gmail.com> wrote:
I have posted several threads about converting 24Hz pulses to 60Hz
basically a 5/2 ratio. I tried a phase locked loop, it sorta works,
but my chip count is getting high, and I am thinking about making more
of these and selling them if I can write a computer program to resolve
wave sound files.
Therefore, since I am not very familiar with micro controllers, I was
not planning on using one. However, I remember an engineer friend of
mine mentioning the BASIC stamp. I have dabbled in BASIC so, I might
approach the problem with this as a solution, especially if I can do
it with one or two chips.
I would think that I could sample the 24Hz side for one second. Take
that number and use it to divide a much higher frequency quartz
reference by some large value of N so that I can get it back down to
60Hz. Therefore my lock time would be one second. I can have an easy
lock indication and a fairly fast response to any changes in
frequency.
What do you guys/gals think?
Regards,
Chris Maness
Holy crap, I did not realize that these things are $80 for a one off.
OK, awkward, inaccurate, and expensive.
and incomplete. What is the "24Hz pulses" in relation to the "wave
sound file"? Do you need to FFT the signal?
It's a continuation of an earlier post, wherein he describes the whole
thing.
--
Tim Wescott
Control system and signal processing consultingwww.wescottdesign.com
I didn't read the earlier post. Can you summarize what he is trying
to do?
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.design/browse_thread/t...
Patching the URL back together is up to you...
On Mar 5, 1:21 pm, Tim Wescott <t...@seemywebsite.now> wrote:
linnix wrote:
On Mar 5, 1:11 pm, Tim Wescott <t...@seemywebsite.now> wrote:
Chris wrote:
On Mar 5, 11:11 am, Chris <christopher.man...@gmail.com> wrote:
I have posted several threads about converting 24Hz pulses to 60Hz
basically a 5/2 ratio. I tried a phase locked loop, it sorta works,
but my chip count is getting high, and I am thinking about making more
of these and selling them if I can write a computer program to resolve
wave sound files.
Therefore, since I am not very familiar with micro controllers, I was
not planning on using one. However, I remember an engineer friend of
mine mentioning the BASIC stamp. I have dabbled in BASIC so, I might
approach the problem with this as a solution, especially if I can do
it with one or two chips.
I would think that I could sample the 24Hz side for one second. Take
that number and use it to divide a much higher frequency quartz
reference by some large value of N so that I can get it back down to
60Hz. Therefore my lock time would be one second. I can have an easy
lock indication and a fairly fast response to any changes in
frequency.
What do you guys/gals think?
Regards,
Chris Maness
Holy crap, I did not realize that these things are $80 for a one off.
OK, awkward, inaccurate, and expensive.
and incomplete. What is the "24Hz pulses" in relation to the "wave
sound file"? Do you need to FFT the signal?
It's a continuation of an earlier post, wherein he describes the whole
thing.
--
Tim Wescott
Control system and signal processing consultingwww.wescottdesign.com
I didn't read the earlier post. Can you summarize what he is trying
to do?
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.design/browse_thread/t...
Patching the URL back together is up to you...
Thanks. I love the part about AVR PICs.
linnix
Guest
Guest
Sat Mar 06, 2010 12:07 am
On Mar 5, 1:46 pm, linnix <m...@linnix.info-for.us> wrote:
Quote:
On Mar 5, 1:30 pm, Chris <christopher.man...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Mar 5, 12:55 pm, linnix <m...@linnix.info-for.us> wrote:
On Mar 5, 11:11 am, Chris <christopher.man...@gmail.com> wrote:
I have posted several threads about converting 24Hz pulses to 60Hz
basically a 5/2 ratio. I tried a phase locked loop, it sorta works,
but my chip count is getting high, and I am thinking about making more
of these and selling them if I can write a computer program to resolve
wave sound files.
Therefore, since I am not very familiar with micro controllers, I was
not planning on using one. However, I remember an engineer friend of
mine mentioning the BASIC stamp. I have dabbled in BASIC so, I might
approach the problem with this as a solution, especially if I can do
it with one or two chips.
I would think that I could sample the 24Hz side for one second. Take
that number and use it to divide a much higher frequency quartz
reference by some large value of N so that I can get it back down to
60Hz. Therefore my lock time would be one second. I can have an easy
lock indication and a fairly fast response to any changes in
frequency.
If your signal is 24Hz, where is the changes in frequency coming
from? We need to know more about the spec first.
What do you guys/gals think?
Regards,
Chris Maness
It comes from the flash contact from a small gauge movie camera.
These cameras have very low precision speed control. Ideally they
would run at exactly at 24Hz. The design is to record the error on a
second track and use a fullcoat deck or a computer to resolve later.
The design would do something similar to:
http://www.webtfg.com/sync11.htm
Regards,
Chris
OK, why can't you record the 24Hz and a stable 60Hz together and
resolve them later.
On Mar 5, 12:55 pm, linnix <m...@linnix.info-for.us> wrote:
On Mar 5, 11:11 am, Chris <christopher.man...@gmail.com> wrote:
I have posted several threads about converting 24Hz pulses to 60Hz
basically a 5/2 ratio. I tried a phase locked loop, it sorta works,
but my chip count is getting high, and I am thinking about making more
of these and selling them if I can write a computer program to resolve
wave sound files.
Therefore, since I am not very familiar with micro controllers, I was
not planning on using one. However, I remember an engineer friend of
mine mentioning the BASIC stamp. I have dabbled in BASIC so, I might
approach the problem with this as a solution, especially if I can do
it with one or two chips.
I would think that I could sample the 24Hz side for one second. Take
that number and use it to divide a much higher frequency quartz
reference by some large value of N so that I can get it back down to
60Hz. Therefore my lock time would be one second. I can have an easy
lock indication and a fairly fast response to any changes in
frequency.
If your signal is 24Hz, where is the changes in frequency coming
from? We need to know more about the spec first.
What do you guys/gals think?
Regards,
Chris Maness
It comes from the flash contact from a small gauge movie camera.
These cameras have very low precision speed control. Ideally they
would run at exactly at 24Hz. The design is to record the error on a
second track and use a fullcoat deck or a computer to resolve later.
The design would do something similar to:
http://www.webtfg.com/sync11.htm
Regards,
Chris
OK, why can't you record the 24Hz and a stable 60Hz together and
resolve them later.
Actually, just recording the 24Hz with the micros time base should be
enough. You are recording sound digitally, right?
Quote:
On the other hand, sampling the 24Hz at 1.44KHz
rate and recreate a 60Hz is doable with a micro.
rate and recreate a 60Hz is doable with a micro.
If you need to drive something externally.
Chris
Guest
Guest
Sat Mar 06, 2010 12:10 am
On Mar 5, 1:46 pm, linnix <m...@linnix.info-for.us> wrote:
Quote:
On Mar 5, 1:30 pm, Chris <christopher.man...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Mar 5, 12:55 pm, linnix <m...@linnix.info-for.us> wrote:
On Mar 5, 11:11 am, Chris <christopher.man...@gmail.com> wrote:
I have posted several threads about converting 24Hz pulses to 60Hz
basically a 5/2 ratio. I tried a phase locked loop, it sorta works,
but my chip count is getting high, and I am thinking about making more
of these and selling them if I can write a computer program to resolve
wave sound files.
Therefore, since I am not very familiar with micro controllers, I was
not planning on using one. However, I remember an engineer friend of
mine mentioning the BASIC stamp. I have dabbled in BASIC so, I might
approach the problem with this as a solution, especially if I can do
it with one or two chips.
I would think that I could sample the 24Hz side for one second. Take
that number and use it to divide a much higher frequency quartz
reference by some large value of N so that I can get it back down to
60Hz. Therefore my lock time would be one second. I can have an easy
lock indication and a fairly fast response to any changes in
frequency.
If your signal is 24Hz, where is the changes in frequency coming
from? We need to know more about the spec first.
What do you guys/gals think?
Regards,
Chris Maness
It comes from the flash contact from a small gauge movie camera.
These cameras have very low precision speed control. Ideally they
would run at exactly at 24Hz. The design is to record the error on a
second track and use a fullcoat deck or a computer to resolve later.
The design would do something similar to:
http://www.webtfg.com/sync11.htm
Regards,
Chris
OK, why can't you record the 24Hz and a stable 60Hz together and
resolve them later.
On Mar 5, 12:55 pm, linnix <m...@linnix.info-for.us> wrote:
On Mar 5, 11:11 am, Chris <christopher.man...@gmail.com> wrote:
I have posted several threads about converting 24Hz pulses to 60Hz
basically a 5/2 ratio. I tried a phase locked loop, it sorta works,
but my chip count is getting high, and I am thinking about making more
of these and selling them if I can write a computer program to resolve
wave sound files.
Therefore, since I am not very familiar with micro controllers, I was
not planning on using one. However, I remember an engineer friend of
mine mentioning the BASIC stamp. I have dabbled in BASIC so, I might
approach the problem with this as a solution, especially if I can do
it with one or two chips.
I would think that I could sample the 24Hz side for one second. Take
that number and use it to divide a much higher frequency quartz
reference by some large value of N so that I can get it back down to
60Hz. Therefore my lock time would be one second. I can have an easy
lock indication and a fairly fast response to any changes in
frequency.
If your signal is 24Hz, where is the changes in frequency coming
from? We need to know more about the spec first.
What do you guys/gals think?
Regards,
Chris Maness
It comes from the flash contact from a small gauge movie camera.
These cameras have very low precision speed control. Ideally they
would run at exactly at 24Hz. The design is to record the error on a
second track and use a fullcoat deck or a computer to resolve later.
The design would do something similar to:
http://www.webtfg.com/sync11.htm
Regards,
Chris
OK, why can't you record the 24Hz and a stable 60Hz together and
resolve them later.
There is a design to output 24Hz pulses of a 1000Hz tone to tape.
This is more intended as a marker for when the camera is running and
when it is not, but I would imagine that it could be used to resolve
the sound.
For my specific application. The 60Hz pulse can be used to drive an
inverter to my fullcoat deck that runs from a sync motor. That is why
I need it on the spot.
On the other hand, sampling the 24Hz at 1.44KHz
Quote:
rate and recreate a 60Hz is doable with a micro.
I was thinking of having an algorithm that measured the freq. every
second and using that number to divide a high freq. reference. I am
interested in your version.
Chris
Jan Panteltje
Guest
Guest
Sat Mar 06, 2010 12:18 am
On a sunny day (Fri, 5 Mar 2010 13:30:26 -0800 (PST)) it happened Chris
<christopher.maness_at_gmail.com> wrote in
<022660f6-b61d-46c1-a011-95127ca40361_at_v20g2000prb.googlegroups.com>:
Quote:
On Mar 5, 12:55 pm, linnix <m...@linnix.info-for.us> wrote:
On Mar 5, 11:11 am, Chris <christopher.man...@gmail.com> wrote:
I have posted several threads about converting 24Hz pulses to 60Hz
basically a 5/2 ratio. I tried a phase locked loop, it sorta works,
but my chip count is getting high, and I am thinking about making more
of these and selling them if I can write a computer program to resolve
wave sound files.
Therefore, since I am not very familiar with micro controllers, I was
not planning on using one. However, I remember an engineer friend of
mine mentioning the BASIC stamp. I have dabbled in BASIC so, I might
approach the problem with this as a solution, especially if I can do
it with one or two chips.
I would think that I could sample the 24Hz side for one second. Take
that number and use it to divide a much higher frequency quartz
reference by some large value of N so that I can get it back down to
60Hz. Therefore my lock time would be one second. I can have an e=
asy
lock indication and a fairly fast response to any changes in
frequency.
If your signal is 24Hz, where is the changes in frequency coming
from? We need to know more about the spec first.
What do you guys/gals think?
Regards,
Chris Maness
It comes from the flash contact from a small gauge movie camera.
These cameras have very low precision speed control. Ideally they
would run at exactly at 24Hz. The design is to record the error on a
second track and use a fullcoat deck or a computer to resolve later.
The design would do something similar to:
http://www.webtfg.com/sync11.htm
Regards,
Chris
On Mar 5, 11:11 am, Chris <christopher.man...@gmail.com> wrote:
I have posted several threads about converting 24Hz pulses to 60Hz
basically a 5/2 ratio. I tried a phase locked loop, it sorta works,
but my chip count is getting high, and I am thinking about making more
of these and selling them if I can write a computer program to resolve
wave sound files.
Therefore, since I am not very familiar with micro controllers, I was
not planning on using one. However, I remember an engineer friend of
mine mentioning the BASIC stamp. I have dabbled in BASIC so, I might
approach the problem with this as a solution, especially if I can do
it with one or two chips.
I would think that I could sample the 24Hz side for one second. Take
that number and use it to divide a much higher frequency quartz
reference by some large value of N so that I can get it back down to
60Hz. Therefore my lock time would be one second. I can have an e=
asy
lock indication and a fairly fast response to any changes in
frequency.
If your signal is 24Hz, where is the changes in frequency coming
from? We need to know more about the spec first.
What do you guys/gals think?
Regards,
Chris Maness
It comes from the flash contact from a small gauge movie camera.
These cameras have very low precision speed control. Ideally they
would run at exactly at 24Hz. The design is to record the error on a
second track and use a fullcoat deck or a computer to resolve later.
The design would do something similar to:
http://www.webtfg.com/sync11.htm
Regards,
Chris
Something like this will be less then 300$:
ftp://panteltje.com/pub/24_to_60Hz_PLL_img_1847.jpg
the way this is supposed to work is:
the camera contact produces a short pulse that opens the 4015 6swicth.
That samples the 24 Hz and the system will stabilise so the camara pulse is centered
around an edge of that 24 Hz waveform.
The 4046 runs at 120 Hz, set for exactly 120 Hz with no camera active.
The 7490 has a divide by 2 and a divide by 5, and makes 24 Hz and 60 Hz from the 120 Hz.
Note the loop filter values.
This is not your normal PLL system, but my own invention.
Before you invest years in learning to program PICs,
maybe you could try this first:-)
I have not tried it for this, but at a slightly higher frequency with different dividers
for in a data separator,
Extremely stable over a wide range.
Just a quick sketch too, not checked for errors.
linnix
Guest
Guest
Sat Mar 06, 2010 12:27 am
On Mar 5, 2:10 pm, Chris <christopher.man...@gmail.com> wrote:
Quote:
On Mar 5, 1:46 pm, linnix <m...@linnix.info-for.us> wrote:
On Mar 5, 1:30 pm, Chris <christopher.man...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Mar 5, 12:55 pm, linnix <m...@linnix.info-for.us> wrote:
On Mar 5, 11:11 am, Chris <christopher.man...@gmail.com> wrote:
I have posted several threads about converting 24Hz pulses to 60Hz
basically a 5/2 ratio. I tried a phase locked loop, it sorta works,
but my chip count is getting high, and I am thinking about making more
of these and selling them if I can write a computer program to resolve
wave sound files.
Therefore, since I am not very familiar with micro controllers, I was
not planning on using one. However, I remember an engineer friend of
mine mentioning the BASIC stamp. I have dabbled in BASIC so, I might
approach the problem with this as a solution, especially if I can do
it with one or two chips.
I would think that I could sample the 24Hz side for one second. Take
that number and use it to divide a much higher frequency quartz
reference by some large value of N so that I can get it back down to
60Hz. Therefore my lock time would be one second. I can have an easy
lock indication and a fairly fast response to any changes in
frequency.
If your signal is 24Hz, where is the changes in frequency coming
from? We need to know more about the spec first.
What do you guys/gals think?
Regards,
Chris Maness
It comes from the flash contact from a small gauge movie camera.
These cameras have very low precision speed control. Ideally they
would run at exactly at 24Hz. The design is to record the error on a
second track and use a fullcoat deck or a computer to resolve later.
The design would do something similar to:
http://www.webtfg.com/sync11.htm
Regards,
Chris
OK, why can't you record the 24Hz and a stable 60Hz together and
resolve them later.
There is a design to output 24Hz pulses of a 1000Hz tone to tape.
This is more intended as a marker for when the camera is running and
when it is not, but I would imagine that it could be used to resolve
the sound.
For my specific application. The 60Hz pulse can be used to drive an
inverter to my fullcoat deck that runs from a sync motor. That is why
I need it on the spot.
On the other hand, sampling the 24Hz at 1.44KHz
rate and recreate a 60Hz is doable with a micro.
I was thinking of having an algorithm that measured the freq. every
second and using that number to divide a high freq. reference. I am
interested in your version.
Chris
On Mar 5, 1:30 pm, Chris <christopher.man...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Mar 5, 12:55 pm, linnix <m...@linnix.info-for.us> wrote:
On Mar 5, 11:11 am, Chris <christopher.man...@gmail.com> wrote:
I have posted several threads about converting 24Hz pulses to 60Hz
basically a 5/2 ratio. I tried a phase locked loop, it sorta works,
but my chip count is getting high, and I am thinking about making more
of these and selling them if I can write a computer program to resolve
wave sound files.
Therefore, since I am not very familiar with micro controllers, I was
not planning on using one. However, I remember an engineer friend of
mine mentioning the BASIC stamp. I have dabbled in BASIC so, I might
approach the problem with this as a solution, especially if I can do
it with one or two chips.
I would think that I could sample the 24Hz side for one second. Take
that number and use it to divide a much higher frequency quartz
reference by some large value of N so that I can get it back down to
60Hz. Therefore my lock time would be one second. I can have an easy
lock indication and a fairly fast response to any changes in
frequency.
If your signal is 24Hz, where is the changes in frequency coming
from? We need to know more about the spec first.
What do you guys/gals think?
Regards,
Chris Maness
It comes from the flash contact from a small gauge movie camera.
These cameras have very low precision speed control. Ideally they
would run at exactly at 24Hz. The design is to record the error on a
second track and use a fullcoat deck or a computer to resolve later.
The design would do something similar to:
http://www.webtfg.com/sync11.htm
Regards,
Chris
OK, why can't you record the 24Hz and a stable 60Hz together and
resolve them later.
There is a design to output 24Hz pulses of a 1000Hz tone to tape.
This is more intended as a marker for when the camera is running and
when it is not, but I would imagine that it could be used to resolve
the sound.
For my specific application. The 60Hz pulse can be used to drive an
inverter to my fullcoat deck that runs from a sync motor. That is why
I need it on the spot.
On the other hand, sampling the 24Hz at 1.44KHz
rate and recreate a 60Hz is doable with a micro.
I was thinking of having an algorithm that measured the freq. every
second and using that number to divide a high freq. reference. I am
interested in your version.
Chris
Why bother? For example, a $2 PIC (Atmega32u2) can compare signals
several hundred thousand times per second.. You can setup the
internal timer interrupt at 60Hz and sync it up with the rising edge
of the 24Hz signal. The whole program can be done in 1 or 2 pages of
code. This PIC includes a USB bootloader for loading complied codes
with WinAVR. The compiler is free and the programmer is free. I am a
free loader.
linnix
Guest
Guest
Sat Mar 06, 2010 1:13 am
On Mar 5, 2:29 pm, Spehro Pefhany <speffS...@interlogDOTyou.knowwhat>
wrote:
Quote:
On Fri, 5 Mar 2010 12:32:47 -0800 (PST), Chris
christopher.man...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Mar 5, 11:59 am, Jan Panteltje <pNaonStpealm...@yahoo.com> wrote:
On a sunny day (Fri, 5 Mar 2010 11:11:38 -0800 (PST)) it happened Chris
christopher.man...@gmail.com> wrote in
29529065-09fc-4636-9a29-c618cbc16...@x1g2000prb.googlegroups.com>:
I have posted several threads about converting 24Hz pulses to 60Hz
basically a 5/2 ratio. I tried a phase locked loop, it sorta works,
but my chip count is getting high, and I am thinking about making more
of these and selling them if I can write a computer program to resolve
wave sound files.
Therefore, since I am not very familiar with micro controllers, I was
not planning on using one. However, I remember an engineer friend of
mine mentioning the BASIC stamp. I have dabbled in BASIC so, I might
approach the problem with this as a solution, especially if I can do
it with one or two chips.
I would think that I could sample the 24Hz side for one second. Take
that number and use it to divide a much higher frequency quartz
reference by some large value of N so that I can get it back down to
60Hz. Therefore my lock time would be one second. I can have an easy
lock indication and a fairly fast response to any changes in
frequency.
What do you guys/gals think?
Regards,
Chris Maness
Years ago I posted a PIC 50 Hz PLL asm code here.
Or maybe it was 25 Hz.
I would not bother with BASIC, likely way too slow, and way too much resources hungry.
A 1$50 12 pin PIC should do...
What are some models that would be good for that application. I see
some 8 pin models that are only $2. The only problem is that I have
NO clue how to start programming them.
Regards,
Chris
Just write code to initialize and make an LED flash at a visible rate.
The rest is easy...
christopher.man...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Mar 5, 11:59 am, Jan Panteltje <pNaonStpealm...@yahoo.com> wrote:
On a sunny day (Fri, 5 Mar 2010 11:11:38 -0800 (PST)) it happened Chris
christopher.man...@gmail.com> wrote in
29529065-09fc-4636-9a29-c618cbc16...@x1g2000prb.googlegroups.com>:
I have posted several threads about converting 24Hz pulses to 60Hz
basically a 5/2 ratio. I tried a phase locked loop, it sorta works,
but my chip count is getting high, and I am thinking about making more
of these and selling them if I can write a computer program to resolve
wave sound files.
Therefore, since I am not very familiar with micro controllers, I was
not planning on using one. However, I remember an engineer friend of
mine mentioning the BASIC stamp. I have dabbled in BASIC so, I might
approach the problem with this as a solution, especially if I can do
it with one or two chips.
I would think that I could sample the 24Hz side for one second. Take
that number and use it to divide a much higher frequency quartz
reference by some large value of N so that I can get it back down to
60Hz. Therefore my lock time would be one second. I can have an easy
lock indication and a fairly fast response to any changes in
frequency.
What do you guys/gals think?
Regards,
Chris Maness
Years ago I posted a PIC 50 Hz PLL asm code here.
Or maybe it was 25 Hz.
I would not bother with BASIC, likely way too slow, and way too much resources hungry.
A 1$50 12 pin PIC should do...
What are some models that would be good for that application. I see
some 8 pin models that are only $2. The only problem is that I have
NO clue how to start programming them.
Regards,
Chris
Just write code to initialize and make an LED flash at a visible rate.
The rest is easy...
Or something like this:
loop()
{
// sample 24Hz input
now = ACSR & (1<<INPUT_BIT_NUMBER); // Analog comparator
if(now && !before) // rising edge
{
// reload 60Hz timer
TCCR1B = 3; // prescale by 64
n = 2083; // 8,000,000 / 64 / 60
TCNT1H = (n<<
&0xff;
TCNT1L = (n)&0xff;
}
before = now;
}
On_Timer1_Interrupt()
{
// pulse 60Hz output
}
Chris
Guest
Guest
Sat Mar 06, 2010 5:55 am
On Mar 5, 3:18 pm, Jan Panteltje <pNaonStpealm...@yahoo.com> wrote:
Quote:
On a sunny day (Fri, 5 Mar 2010 13:30:26 -0800 (PST)) it happened Chris
christopher.man...@gmail.com> wrote in
022660f6-b61d-46c1-a011-95127ca40...@v20g2000prb.googlegroups.com>:
On Mar 5, 12:55 pm, linnix <m...@linnix.info-for.us> wrote:
On Mar 5, 11:11 am, Chris <christopher.man...@gmail.com> wrote:
I have posted several threads about converting 24Hz pulses to 60Hz
basically a 5/2 ratio. I tried a phase locked loop, it sorta works,
but my chip count is getting high, and I am thinking about making more
of these and selling them if I can write a computer program to resolve
wave sound files.
Therefore, since I am not very familiar with micro controllers, I was
not planning on using one. However, I remember an engineer friend of
mine mentioning the BASIC stamp. I have dabbled in BASIC so, I might
approach the problem with this as a solution, especially if I can do
it with one or two chips.
I would think that I could sample the 24Hz side for one second. Take
that number and use it to divide a much higher frequency quartz
reference by some large value of N so that I can get it back down to
60Hz. Therefore my lock time would be one second. I can have an e> >asy
lock indication and a fairly fast response to any changes in
frequency.
If your signal is 24Hz, where is the changes in frequency coming
from? We need to know more about the spec first.
What do you guys/gals think?
Regards,
Chris Maness
It comes from the flash contact from a small gauge movie camera.
These cameras have very low precision speed control. Ideally they
would run at exactly at 24Hz. The design is to record the error on a
second track and use a fullcoat deck or a computer to resolve later.
The design would do something similar to:
http://www.webtfg.com/sync11.htm
Regards,
Chris
Something like this will be less then 300$:
ftp://panteltje.com/pub/24_to_60Hz_PLL_img_1847.jpg
the way this is supposed to work is:
the camera contact produces a short pulse that opens the 4015 6swicth.
That samples the 24 Hz and the system will stabilise so the camara pulse is centered
around an edge of that 24 Hz waveform.
The 4046 runs at 120 Hz, set for exactly 120 Hz with no camera active.
The 7490 has a divide by 2 and a divide by 5, and makes 24 Hz and 60 Hz from the 120 Hz.
Note the loop filter values.
This is not your normal PLL system, but my own invention.
Before you invest years in learning to program PICs,
maybe you could try this first:-)
I have not tried it for this, but at a slightly higher frequency with different dividers
for in a data separator,
Extremely stable over a wide range.
Just a quick sketch too, not checked for errors.
christopher.man...@gmail.com> wrote in
022660f6-b61d-46c1-a011-95127ca40...@v20g2000prb.googlegroups.com>:
On Mar 5, 12:55 pm, linnix <m...@linnix.info-for.us> wrote:
On Mar 5, 11:11 am, Chris <christopher.man...@gmail.com> wrote:
I have posted several threads about converting 24Hz pulses to 60Hz
basically a 5/2 ratio. I tried a phase locked loop, it sorta works,
but my chip count is getting high, and I am thinking about making more
of these and selling them if I can write a computer program to resolve
wave sound files.
Therefore, since I am not very familiar with micro controllers, I was
not planning on using one. However, I remember an engineer friend of
mine mentioning the BASIC stamp. I have dabbled in BASIC so, I might
approach the problem with this as a solution, especially if I can do
it with one or two chips.
I would think that I could sample the 24Hz side for one second. Take
that number and use it to divide a much higher frequency quartz
reference by some large value of N so that I can get it back down to
60Hz. Therefore my lock time would be one second. I can have an e> >asy
lock indication and a fairly fast response to any changes in
frequency.
If your signal is 24Hz, where is the changes in frequency coming
from? We need to know more about the spec first.
What do you guys/gals think?
Regards,
Chris Maness
It comes from the flash contact from a small gauge movie camera.
These cameras have very low precision speed control. Ideally they
would run at exactly at 24Hz. The design is to record the error on a
second track and use a fullcoat deck or a computer to resolve later.
The design would do something similar to:
http://www.webtfg.com/sync11.htm
Regards,
Chris
Something like this will be less then 300$:
ftp://panteltje.com/pub/24_to_60Hz_PLL_img_1847.jpg
the way this is supposed to work is:
the camera contact produces a short pulse that opens the 4015 6swicth.
That samples the 24 Hz and the system will stabilise so the camara pulse is centered
around an edge of that 24 Hz waveform.
The 4046 runs at 120 Hz, set for exactly 120 Hz with no camera active.
The 7490 has a divide by 2 and a divide by 5, and makes 24 Hz and 60 Hz from the 120 Hz.
Note the loop filter values.
This is not your normal PLL system, but my own invention.
Before you invest years in learning to program PICs,
maybe you could try this first:-)
I have not tried it for this, but at a slightly higher frequency with different dividers
for in a data separator,
Extremely stable over a wide range.
Just a quick sketch too, not checked for errors.
I am interested since I already have the parts. What do you think the
lock time would be? My design is very similar but I need to re design
the loop filter. I have a large C and small R, but I have seen
another design that has a a large R and small C. The lock takes
several seconds tho with the large RC constant. All the wile precious
film is burning through the camera. If I use a smaller RC constant
then the jitter becomes unacceptable.
Another big problem is the loop is locking on the wrong frequency on
the camera. It works fine when I simulate the camera with a
multivibe, but is locking strangely with the camera. I tried a low
pass to filter bounces, it changed the lock frequency, but still not
correct.
The design requires a lock indication so that the operator will know
when the pilot tone is up to pitch so that the movie can be slated.
My fullcoat deck takes about 6 or 7 seconds for the fly wheel to get
up to speed. The pitch is fine on this, but there is bad flutter
until the flywheel is at speed.
I see that your design incorporates a debounce. I am interested, but
I am having a little tough time reading the schematic. Also, I might
suggest I higher frequency for the VCO, I found that it was more
stable at a higher frequency, and no big deal to divide down. Divide
by 80 in the loop, and divide by 32 on the output.
I am friends with a guy that deals with a lot of pros that shoot small
gauge film, and I might be able to incorporate this with some software
and a PCM recorder. Right now, I am just trying to get my camera to
play with my full coat deck.
Chris
Chris
Guest
Guest
Sat Mar 06, 2010 6:00 am
@linnix
p.s.
One more thing. I am really interested in what you did for your
debounce. I was planning on using a NE555 in monostable mode for 20ms
pulse to clean up the debounce. I was also planning on using a NE555
in mono for 60ms to latch and stay on as long as there is input into
the converter box, but shut the loop down when there is no input. I
do not want pulses going to the tape deck when the movie camera is not
running.
Regards,
and thanks a ton all of you guys,
Chris Maness
linnix
Guest
Guest
Sat Mar 06, 2010 6:57 am
On Mar 5, 8:00 pm, Chris <christopher.man...@gmail.com> wrote:
Quote:
@linnix
p.s.
One more thing. I am really interested in what you did for your
debounce.
p.s.
One more thing. I am really interested in what you did for your
debounce.
For debouncing, you can just wait a few msec after the loop, or just
do some other processings.
Quote:
I was planning on using a NE555 in monostable mode for 20ms
pulse to clean up the debounce.
pulse to clean up the debounce.
Atmel's PIC (Programmable IC) with crystal is far more accurate than
the 555.
Quote:
I was also planning on using a NE555
in mono for 60ms to latch and stay on as long as there is input into
the converter box, but shut the loop down when there is no input. I
do not want pulses going to the tape deck when the movie camera is not
running.
in mono for 60ms to latch and stay on as long as there is input into
the converter box, but shut the loop down when there is no input. I
do not want pulses going to the tape deck when the movie camera is not
running.
So, limit the timer interrupt free-running counts.
Since you want a square output, use 120Hz timer interrupt.
Revised code:
loop()
{
// Analog comparator sample 24Hz input
now = ACSR & (1<<INPUT_BIT_NUMBER);
if(now && !before) // rising edge
{
// reload 120Hz timer
TCCR1B = 3; // prescale by 64
n = 1541; // 8,000,000 / 64 / 120
TCNT1H = (n<<
&0xff;
TCNT1L = (n)&0xff;
run = 0;
// enable timer1 interrupt
}
before = now;
}
On_Timer1_Interrupt()
{
// toggle 60Hz output bit
OUTPUT_PORT ^= (1<<OUTPUT_BIT_NUMBER);
if(++run < 3)
//enable timer1 interrupt
}
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