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Ian Jackson
Guest
Guest
Thu Sep 16, 2010 10:06 am
In message <f7i396pianstgvqk9ii0ebdqgh8n38a2ug_at_4ax.com>, Spike
<Aero.Spike_at_S&T.invalid> writes
Quote:
Brian Gregory [UK] wrote:
"Brian Morrison" <bdm_at_fenrir.org.uk> wrote in message
news:20100915160950.00004a2d_at_surtees.fenrir.org.uk...
On Wed, 15 Sep 2010 15:49:26 +0100
Spike <Aero.Spike_at_S&T.invalid> wrote:
Sanyo (various deals) are avalable from Amazon:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/s/ref=nb_sb_noss?url=search-alias%3Daps&field
-keywords=eneloop&x=19&y=23
and the ReCyko ones are in the list somewhere.
I have bought 4 from a trader on Ebay, at a shade under 7 GBP. I do
like the idea that they hold their charge for a long time, I had not
realised that hybrid NiMH did that. The capacity is a little lower than
I'd like, but I suspect more of it may be usable so it may not be such
a loss.
I use Vapex Instants.
http://www.vapextech.co.uk/acatalog/High_Power_Consumer_Batteries.html#a18
The charge retention on the Vapex seems inferior to the Eneloop:
Vapex 6 months About 80% of charge is held
12 months About 70% of charge is held
Eneloop: 90 per cent of the charge after 6 months
85 per cent after 12 months
and the Eneloops are cheaper; an 8-pack is £15.59 with free shipping
from Amazon.
Over the past three years, I have, at radio rallies, bought 4 packs of 4
Vapex AAs (2700 and 2800mAh). So far, four have gone bad. They rapidly
lost their charge and, beneath the plastic, the casing went 'bubbly' and
'lumpy'. I have no idea why this should have happened. They were all
used for light duties - powering radios and the like, and generally
treated well.
On the other hand, I'm still using some AA nicads, which came out of a
printed circuit board, bought at one of the Shuttleworth rallies, some
20 years ago (even if they have now been relegated to powering some
solar powered garden lights!).
--
Ian
Walt Davidson
Guest
Guest
Thu Sep 16, 2010 11:06 am
On Thu, 16 Sep 2010 10:06:31 +0100, Ian Jackson
<ianREMOVETHISjackson_at_g3ohx.demon.co.uk> wrote:
Quote:
Over the past three years, I have, at radio rallies, bought 4 packs of 4
Vapex AAs (2700 and 2800mAh). So far, four have gone bad. They rapidly
lost their charge and, beneath the plastic, the casing went 'bubbly' and
'lumpy'. I have no idea why this should have happened. They were all
used for light duties - powering radios and the like, and generally
treated well.
On the other hand, I'm still using some AA nicads, which came out of a
printed circuit board, bought at one of the Shuttleworth rallies, some
20 years ago (even if they have now been relegated to powering some
solar powered garden lights!).
Vapex AAs (2700 and 2800mAh). So far, four have gone bad. They rapidly
lost their charge and, beneath the plastic, the casing went 'bubbly' and
'lumpy'. I have no idea why this should have happened. They were all
used for light duties - powering radios and the like, and generally
treated well.
On the other hand, I'm still using some AA nicads, which came out of a
printed circuit board, bought at one of the Shuttleworth rallies, some
20 years ago (even if they have now been relegated to powering some
solar powered garden lights!).
FWIW, the best NiMH cells I have ever bought are Ansmann 2850 maH fast
rechargeable.
They are not the cheapest, but worth the little extra. They are
available, together with an Ansmann intelligent charger, from
Amazon.co.uk
73 de G3NYY
--
Walt Davidson Email: g3nyy @despammed.com
Spike
Guest
Guest
Thu Sep 16, 2010 11:38 am
Walt Davidson wrote:
Quote:
FWIW, the best NiMH cells I have ever bought are Ansmann 2850 maH fast
rechargeable.
rechargeable.
For various values of 'best', of course.
The two options seem to be high capacity with significant
self-discharge rates, or lesser capacity with superior charge
retention times.
Quote:
73 de G3NYY
Spike
Walt Davidson
Guest
Guest
Thu Sep 16, 2010 11:58 am
On Thu, 16 Sep 2010 11:38:34 +0100, Spike <Aero.Spike_at_S&T.invalid>
wrote:
Quote:
Walt Davidson wrote:
FWIW, the best NiMH cells I have ever bought are Ansmann 2850 maH fast
rechargeable.
For various values of 'best', of course.
The two options seem to be high capacity with significant
self-discharge rates, or lesser capacity with superior charge
retention times.
In my experience of using these cells, it is not a case of
"either/or". They appear to have both high capacity and good charge
retention performance.
73 de G3NYY
--
Walt Davidson Email: g3nyy @despammed.com
Brian Morrison
Guest
Guest
Thu Sep 16, 2010 12:17 pm
On Thu, 16 Sep 2010 11:58:54 +0100
Walt Davidson <g3nyy_at_invalid.invalid> wrote:
Quote:
On Thu, 16 Sep 2010 11:38:34 +0100, Spike <Aero.Spike_at_S&T.invalid
wrote:
Walt Davidson wrote:
FWIW, the best NiMH cells I have ever bought are Ansmann 2850 maH
fast rechargeable.
For various values of 'best', of course.
The two options seem to be high capacity with significant
self-discharge rates, or lesser capacity with superior charge
retention times.
In my experience of using these cells, it is not a case of
"either/or". They appear to have both high capacity and good charge
retention performance.
wrote:
Walt Davidson wrote:
FWIW, the best NiMH cells I have ever bought are Ansmann 2850 maH
fast rechargeable.
For various values of 'best', of course.
The two options seem to be high capacity with significant
self-discharge rates, or lesser capacity with superior charge
retention times.
In my experience of using these cells, it is not a case of
"either/or". They appear to have both high capacity and good charge
retention performance.
What do you class as good in that respect?
--
Brian Morrison
Brian Gregory [UK]
Guest
Guest
Thu Sep 16, 2010 12:58 pm
"Ian Jackson" <ianREMOVETHISjackson_at_g3ohx.demon.co.uk> wrote in message
news:DtyBpFFX4dkMFw5O_at_g3ohx.demon.co.uk...
Quote:
In message <f7i396pianstgvqk9ii0ebdqgh8n38a2ug_at_4ax.com>, Spike
Aero.Spike_at_S&T.invalid> writes
Brian Gregory [UK] wrote:
"Brian Morrison" <bdm_at_fenrir.org.uk> wrote in message
news:20100915160950.00004a2d_at_surtees.fenrir.org.uk...
On Wed, 15 Sep 2010 15:49:26 +0100
Spike <Aero.Spike_at_S&T.invalid> wrote:
Sanyo (various deals) are avalable from Amazon:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/s/ref=nb_sb_noss?url=search-alias%3Daps&field
-keywords=eneloop&x=19&y=23
and the ReCyko ones are in the list somewhere.
I have bought 4 from a trader on Ebay, at a shade under 7 GBP. I do
like the idea that they hold their charge for a long time, I had not
realised that hybrid NiMH did that. The capacity is a little lower than
I'd like, but I suspect more of it may be usable so it may not be such
a loss.
I use Vapex Instants.
http://www.vapextech.co.uk/acatalog/High_Power_Consumer_Batteries.html#a18
The charge retention on the Vapex seems inferior to the Eneloop:
Vapex 6 months About 80% of charge is held
12 months About 70% of charge is held
Eneloop: 90 per cent of the charge after 6 months
85 per cent after 12 months
and the Eneloops are cheaper; an 8-pack is £15.59 with free shipping
from Amazon.
Aero.Spike_at_S&T.invalid> writes
Brian Gregory [UK] wrote:
"Brian Morrison" <bdm_at_fenrir.org.uk> wrote in message
news:20100915160950.00004a2d_at_surtees.fenrir.org.uk...
On Wed, 15 Sep 2010 15:49:26 +0100
Spike <Aero.Spike_at_S&T.invalid> wrote:
Sanyo (various deals) are avalable from Amazon:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/s/ref=nb_sb_noss?url=search-alias%3Daps&field
-keywords=eneloop&x=19&y=23
and the ReCyko ones are in the list somewhere.
I have bought 4 from a trader on Ebay, at a shade under 7 GBP. I do
like the idea that they hold their charge for a long time, I had not
realised that hybrid NiMH did that. The capacity is a little lower than
I'd like, but I suspect more of it may be usable so it may not be such
a loss.
I use Vapex Instants.
http://www.vapextech.co.uk/acatalog/High_Power_Consumer_Batteries.html#a18
The charge retention on the Vapex seems inferior to the Eneloop:
Vapex 6 months About 80% of charge is held
12 months About 70% of charge is held
Eneloop: 90 per cent of the charge after 6 months
85 per cent after 12 months
and the Eneloops are cheaper; an 8-pack is £15.59 with free shipping
from Amazon.
8 Instants from vapextech.co.uk would be £10.50 with free shipping.
But maybe I'll try Eneloops some time.
Quote:
Over the past three years, I have, at radio rallies, bought 4 packs of 4
Vapex AAs (2700 and 2800mAh). So far, four have gone bad. They rapidly
lost their charge and, beneath the plastic, the casing went 'bubbly' and
'lumpy'. I have no idea why this should have happened. They were all used
for light duties - powering radios and the like, and generally treated
well.
Yes I only like the Vapex "Instant" ones.
They're 2100mAH low self discharge.
Quote:
On the other hand, I'm still using some AA nicads, which came out of a
printed circuit board, bought at one of the Shuttleworth rallies, some 20
years ago (even if they have now been relegated to powering some solar
powered garden lights!).
printed circuit board, bought at one of the Shuttleworth rallies, some 20
years ago (even if they have now been relegated to powering some solar
powered garden lights!).
--
Brian Gregory. (In the UK)
ng_at_bgdsv.co.uk
To email me remove the letter vee.
Walt Davidson
Guest
Guest
Thu Sep 16, 2010 6:54 pm
On Thu, 16 Sep 2010 12:17:57 +0100, Brian Morrison <bdm_at_fenrir.org.uk>
wrote:
Quote:
In my experience of using these cells, it is not a case of
"either/or". They appear to have both high capacity and good charge
retention performance.
What do you class as good in that respect?
"either/or". They appear to have both high capacity and good charge
retention performance.
What do you class as good in that respect?
"Good" is an AA NiMH cell with any capacity higher than 2500 maH. As
far as charge retention is concerned, I have kept some of these cells
on the shelf for 2 months after fully charging and find them, as far
as I can determine, still fully charged ... in the sense that they
will power a radio for the expected time/duty cycle, just as if newly
charged.
Of course Spike will be along in a minute to tell us that is a
thoroughly unscientific assessment.
:-)
73 de G3NYY
--
Walt Davidson Email: g3nyy @despammed.com
Brian Reay
Guest
Guest
Thu Sep 16, 2010 7:21 pm
"Walt Davidson" <g3nyy_at_invalid.invalid> wrote in message
news:74m496ho7bcn9ff7kp76agf4hv5hfk2p8t_at_4ax.com...
Quote:
On Thu, 16 Sep 2010 12:17:57 +0100, Brian Morrison <bdm_at_fenrir.org.uk
wrote:
In my experience of using these cells, it is not a case of
"either/or". They appear to have both high capacity and good charge
retention performance.
What do you class as good in that respect?
"Good" is an AA NiMH cell with any capacity higher than 2500 maH. As
far as charge retention is concerned, I have kept some of these cells
on the shelf for 2 months after fully charging and find them, as far
as I can determine, still fully charged ... in the sense that they
will power a radio for the expected time/duty cycle, just as if newly
charged.
wrote:
In my experience of using these cells, it is not a case of
"either/or". They appear to have both high capacity and good charge
retention performance.
What do you class as good in that respect?
"Good" is an AA NiMH cell with any capacity higher than 2500 maH. As
far as charge retention is concerned, I have kept some of these cells
on the shelf for 2 months after fully charging and find them, as far
as I can determine, still fully charged ... in the sense that they
will power a radio for the expected time/duty cycle, just as if newly
charged.
In my experience, the low self-discharge rate of NiMH cells is remarkable.
As you say, 2 mths seems to have little practical effect on the state of
charge. In contrast, the old NiCd cells seemed to self discharge
significantly in a couple of weeks.
One thing, the coulometric charge efficiency of NiMH cells is about 65% and
seems more consistant that the figure for NiCD cells, which varies with
charge rate.
The coulometric charge efficiency increases with charge rate.
Quote:
Of course Spike will be along in a minute to tell us that is a
thoroughly unscientific assessment.
thoroughly unscientific assessment.
I'd not let Spike bother you Walt.
--
73
Brian G8OSN/W8OSN
www.g8osn.net
Spike
Guest
Guest
Thu Sep 16, 2010 7:43 pm
Brian Reay wrote:
Quote:
In my experience
And that's your problem, I suspect.
When it comes to people bringing up such matters as civil liberties,
the politicisation of the police, dilemmas caused by one law tripping
over another, and now the choice between outright capacity and charge
retention in AA cells, it is met by you saying something along the
lines of "were you there?" or "there's more to this than has been
reported" or "I've never seen that", among other well-used cliches.
That is, you comment, apparently, based on your experience.
Since this may be limited, and other people have other experiences
even of the same topic, it's indeed a very weak line to take.
With AA cells there is at least some numbers to be found, and I was
forthright enough to at least publish the data associated with the
cells in question - but what do you come back with? Experience...
....and not a fact in sight. Do facts scare you in some way? Can't you
handle them? Do you even know where to find them?
Perhaps you'd best stick to training the trainers, the title alone
suggests there isn't a single fact there to disturb your equilibrium.
Spike
Brian Reay
Guest
Guest
Thu Sep 16, 2010 7:56 pm
"Spike" <Aero.Spike_at_S&T.invalid> wrote in message
news:eeo496huqjm9kp2aijr0ft9024b9va1k5u_at_4ax.com...
Quote:
Brian Reay wrote:
In my experience
And that's your problem, I suspect.
snipped
Have you been drinking the water in Chippenham or Renfrew?
;-)
--
73
Brian G8OSN/W8OSN
www.g8osn.net
Spike
Guest
Guest
Thu Sep 16, 2010 8:25 pm
Brian Reay wrote:
Quote:
"Spike" <Aero.Spike_at_S&T.invalid> wrote in message
news:eeo496huqjm9kp2aijr0ft9024b9va1k5u_at_4ax.com...
Brian Reay wrote:
In my experience
And that's your problem, I suspect.
snipped
Have you been drinking the water in Chippenham or Renfrew?
;-)
news:eeo496huqjm9kp2aijr0ft9024b9va1k5u_at_4ax.com...
Brian Reay wrote:
In my experience
And that's your problem, I suspect.
snipped
Have you been drinking the water in Chippenham or Renfrew?
;-)
One of those places is in a foreign country, and the other seems as if
it is on another planet...
Spike
M0WYM
Guest
Guest
Thu Sep 16, 2010 8:48 pm
On 16/09/10 19:43, Spike wrote:
Quote:
Perhaps you'd best stick to training the trainers, the title alone
suggests there isn't a single fact there to disturb your equilibrium.
Spike
suggests there isn't a single fact there to disturb your equilibrium.
Spike
I'm not sure about that as, in another group, he didn't appear to
realise the effect on linearity of placing a resistor in parallel with a
multiturn .25% linearity pot!
Charlie.
--
M0WYM
www.radiowymsey.org
Sales @ radiowymsey
http://shop.ebay.co.uk/gnome7763/m.html?
Brian Reay
Guest
Guest
Thu Sep 16, 2010 9:16 pm
"M0WYM" <nospammers_at_radiowymsey.org> wrote in message
news:i6tsb0$v29$1_at_news.eternal-september.org...
Quote:
On 16/09/10 19:43, Spike wrote:
Perhaps you'd best stick to training the trainers, the title alone
suggests there isn't a single fact there to disturb your equilibrium.
Spike
I'm not sure about that as, in another group, he didn't appear to realise
the effect on linearity of placing a resistor in parallel with a multiturn
.25% linearity pot!
Perhaps you'd best stick to training the trainers, the title alone
suggests there isn't a single fact there to disturb your equilibrium.
Spike
I'm not sure about that as, in another group, he didn't appear to realise
the effect on linearity of placing a resistor in parallel with a multiturn
.25% linearity pot!
Money where mouth is time Charlie, tell us the problem in the application
given.
no name
Guest
Guest
Fri Oct 01, 2010 10:10 pm
"Brian Reay" <seewebsite_at_invaild.com> wrote in message
news:XLtko.98583$Y12.20501_at_newsfe25.ams2...
Quote:
"Spike" <Aero.Spike_at_S&T.invalid> wrote in message
news:eeo496huqjm9kp2aijr0ft9024b9va1k5u_at_4ax.com...
Brian Reay wrote:
In my experience
And that's your problem, I suspect.
snipped
Have you been drinking the water in Chippenham or Renfrew?
;-)
news:eeo496huqjm9kp2aijr0ft9024b9va1k5u_at_4ax.com...
Brian Reay wrote:
In my experience
And that's your problem, I suspect.
snipped
Have you been drinking the water in Chippenham or Renfrew?
;-)
More probably that at ME7 3RT
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